A very good example of the nonsense.
Can you say Afghani, Uzbeki - or Scot?
Can you say Afghani, Uzbeki - or Scot?
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Why not. Context matters. The word p a k i has been used more often as a racial slur.
Frog.
I think these types of thread are quite interesting. I'm hazarding a guess (although happy to stand corrected) that most people participating are white. So the chances are you've never really experienced much racist activity (minor or major) directed towards you. Therefore whilst you can sympathise, it can be asserted you can't really empathise or fully understand how it feels to have actions, comments, looks directed towards you that you interpret as being racist or having racist undertones.
I'm biracial, nearing 50, and thankfully have not experienced a great deal of racism in my life. However I have nevertheless experienced it. To an extent I get fed up with discussions around assertions such as 'it's my right to say what I want and it's up to you as to whether or not I've caused you offence' as often, although not always, these arguments are put forward simply because some people don't want to adjust the way they socially interact.
Maybe going off on a tangent here however let me give you just one very low level example. I remember one time I was standing in a longish queue waiting to pay for fuel. There were maybe 3-4 people in front of me. The woman serving was being very polite, smiley and chirpy with everyone. 'Hello love, just the fuel? There's your change, thanks love' etc etc. Then it was my turn to be served. I noticed a distinct change in her entire demeanor. All that was said to me was along the lines of 'That'll be £20.' I walk away, next person gets served and she immediately reverts to type 'Hello love, just the paper is it? There you go, thanks love.' Now of course there could be any number of reasons for this, I accept that. However as a biracial person with a few decades on the planet, trust me, you get attuned to certain scenarios. Of course it's possible to misinterpret, not saying it's not.
I often use the imaginary scenario of the meeting room before I open my gob. Example. Imagine you're in a meeting with x people. In the room there's someone that looks as though they possibly originate from Pakistan. You're asked 'what's the problem with the order we've placed?' You know the answer is the supplier, based in Pakistan, has failed to deliver when promised. Now, outside the meeting room, let's say your normal response would be 'it's those blo0dy Pa*i's again!' However in your meeting, there's someone possibly from Pakistan sitting opposite you. Would you go ahead and say 'it's those blo0dy Pa*i's again' or might you choose a different way to answer the question? If the latter, in my mind this means you know the response isn't socially acceptable, so why use it? I just apply this in all scenarios.
I also think about the knock-on consequences of my actions. My mum is white Scottish, my dad was Indian. Mum had numerous situations in work/social settings (dad not there) when people would be talking about 'Pa*i's' (cause you know, one term covers them all) seemingly forgetting she was married to someone of that origin! To this day she recalls how much that hurt her. You might have lived your life thinking it's harmless to poke fun at disabled people whether they overhear you or not. Can you hand on heart say you'd still be of that opinion if you had a disabled child and you overheard a group of people making fun of them e.g. when sitting in a restaurant? Still harmless fun? You might even go over and join in with them, yeah?
I think it's pretty simple. If you conclude your actions might offend, try to take a different approach.
I'm biracial, nearing 50, and thankfully have not experienced a great deal of racism in my life. However I have nevertheless experienced it. To an extent I get fed up with discussions around assertions such as 'it's my right to say what I want and it's up to you as to whether or not I've caused you offence' as often, although not always, these arguments are put forward simply because some people don't want to adjust the way they socially interact.
Maybe going off on a tangent here however let me give you just one very low level example. I remember one time I was standing in a longish queue waiting to pay for fuel. There were maybe 3-4 people in front of me. The woman serving was being very polite, smiley and chirpy with everyone. 'Hello love, just the fuel? There's your change, thanks love' etc etc. Then it was my turn to be served. I noticed a distinct change in her entire demeanor. All that was said to me was along the lines of 'That'll be £20.' I walk away, next person gets served and she immediately reverts to type 'Hello love, just the paper is it? There you go, thanks love.' Now of course there could be any number of reasons for this, I accept that. However as a biracial person with a few decades on the planet, trust me, you get attuned to certain scenarios. Of course it's possible to misinterpret, not saying it's not.
I often use the imaginary scenario of the meeting room before I open my gob. Example. Imagine you're in a meeting with x people. In the room there's someone that looks as though they possibly originate from Pakistan. You're asked 'what's the problem with the order we've placed?' You know the answer is the supplier, based in Pakistan, has failed to deliver when promised. Now, outside the meeting room, let's say your normal response would be 'it's those blo0dy Pa*i's again!' However in your meeting, there's someone possibly from Pakistan sitting opposite you. Would you go ahead and say 'it's those blo0dy Pa*i's again' or might you choose a different way to answer the question? If the latter, in my mind this means you know the response isn't socially acceptable, so why use it? I just apply this in all scenarios.
I also think about the knock-on consequences of my actions. My mum is white Scottish, my dad was Indian. Mum had numerous situations in work/social settings (dad not there) when people would be talking about 'Pa*i's' (cause you know, one term covers them all) seemingly forgetting she was married to someone of that origin! To this day she recalls how much that hurt her. You might have lived your life thinking it's harmless to poke fun at disabled people whether they overhear you or not. Can you hand on heart say you'd still be of that opinion if you had a disabled child and you overheard a group of people making fun of them e.g. when sitting in a restaurant? Still harmless fun? You might even go over and join in with them, yeah?
I think it's pretty simple. If you conclude your actions might offend, try to take a different approach.
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Did your mum ever encounter "It's those bloody Scots again" or heaven forbid "It's those bloody Jocks again"?
That racists used the word "****" (often to Indians) does not alter the fact that it is the name of the country of Pakistan meaning Pakiland like Scotland and therefore cannot be racist in itself - not to mention, of course that Pakistanis are not a race.
I have written all those words in full so it is interesting which is censored by the site while the others are not.
That racists used the word "****" (often to Indians) does not alter the fact that it is the name of the country of Pakistan meaning Pakiland like Scotland and therefore cannot be racist in itself - not to mention, of course that Pakistanis are not a race.
I have written all those words in full so it is interesting which is censored by the site while the others are not.
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durhamplumber
Not as simple as showing intent to be racist..Some words such as gollywog are just banned in certain spheres.
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durhamplumber
And what do we do about the people who seek out offence in alsorts...such as ""Grease"" being ""Rapey""..."femininist" ""Pervy"" etc ..ban that too??
Your obsession with objecting to anything I write is just weird.
Don't think I mentioned anything in my post about banning anything? Nor did I mention anything about those who seek out offence.
Thanks.
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durhamplumber
I have not read your post..Referring to Gal's posts.Sorry.I read the last sentence
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durhamplumber
That could be you jumping to conclusions
So you quoted a bit of my post without reading the context? Okay then ...
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durhamplumber
You are possibly hyper sensitive,looking for racism and finding it where it is not intended..Maybe you had a stern look on your face,, maybe she thought you might find offence in being called "" love""
Now of course there could be any number of reasons for this, I accept that.
(from my post)
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