Never a truer word spoken...(cont)

[EFLImpudence]

Purely, I am British, I live in Britain.

There are people here who are Portuguese and they live in Portugal, so what was the purpose of your question and nationality?

If I leave the country I expect to produce a passport.

Well, obviously; that's what they are for.

I don't want to prove anything else to anybody, unless some authority has a need to investigate me. It has not happened in my lifetime so far.

So, if an authority needs to investigate you, you will prove something.
Does the fact that you don't have a passport not signify to you that you don't need one?

That I have one is a disadvantage to me, how exactly?


I don't think you know what you are arguing about.

 

[Yafo]

I have a passport, and use it regularly, thank you.

Go back to the very 1st post and the point raised. It is pertinent.

Or do only some people have to prove their identity to live here? Does that remind you of some time and events in history ?

 

[EFLImpudence]

How then, can you prove that you are not in Britain illegally, should the need arise, than by proving you are there legally?

I think you should be much more worried about your mobile phone if you are concerned about snooping.

 

[Yafo]

How then, can you prove that you are not in Britain illegally, should the need arise, than by proving you are there legally?

I think you should be much more worried about your mobile phone if you are concerned about snooping.

I am very aware of how tracked I am.

As I said ages ago, I can prove who I am, should that need arise. Does that need, need to arise though?

Odd as it may seem, I think you are arguing the same point?

 

[ellal]

How then, can you prove that you are not in Britain illegally

Or more to the point, how can you prove you are in Britain legally?

Any new ID database will have to have a reference point.

Citizenship differs from the 'right to abode', and both are dependant on the definition at any point in time according to 'authority'.

My partner has indefinite leave to remain in her passport and on official Home Office documentation...

But after nearly 3 decades living in this country, that is now apparently worth jack sh it!

So in other words your proof of a legal right to be in the UK isn't worth the paper it's currently written on.

And anyone who thinks they won't have to 'prove it' as regards the right to live here (citizen or not) is living in cloud cuckoo land!

 

[ellal]

As I said ages ago, I can prove who I am, should that need arise.

How exactly can you do that?

 

[EFLImpudence]

Or more to the point, how can you prove you are in Britain legally?

Well, until the Windrush people's experience, I would have thought it easy. Their treatment is beyond my understanding.
I can only think it is because of incompetence rather than anything more sinister.

However, I have a birth certificate. Does that prove it is mine? I will argue with them.

As for your partner, I hope you have no problems.

I cannot imagine you will, but, if you do then Britain will not be the place you thought it was, will it?

 

[Ian H]

I doubt I am the only 1, but I don't have an NI card, but I have an NI number. I don't have a photocard driving licence, but I do have a driving licence.

What will happen when you renew your driving licence?

What would happen if you didn’t know your NI number?

 

[Brigade77]

As I said ages ago, I can prove who I am, should that need arise. Does that need, need to arise though?

Odd as it may seem, I think you are arguing the same point?

To object to the introduction of an ID card on the basis that you don't need one to prove your ID is wrong.

This is not why they wish to introduce them.

If you are aware of the reasons why they wish to introduce them then you should object to them on those reasons.

These cards cannot be introduced unless they fool most of the people some of the time. As is usual these days, they are using the tactics of getting the foolish to actually insist that they are introduced.

 

[ellal]

However, I have a birth certificate. Does that prove it is mine? I will argue with them.

You can argue all you like, but as soon as you obtain a birth certificate you are in fact effectively 'owned' by the state.
And any document issued by the state can be withdrawn/withheld/altered for whatever reason by the state.
(Remember the withdrawal of passports for not only those convicted of football hooliganism, but 'alleged offenders'? Or the withdrawal of driving licences from those alleged not to have paid CSA maintenance?)

That is because you are in fact what is known as a 'legal fiction'.
Look it up - it's most revealing!

Hence your 'legal status' as regards the right to be in the UK is not in your hands, even if you believe you can 'prove' who you are.
(And millions of EU citizens are about to find that out!)

The Windrush situation indeed shows that whether by incomptence or by design (given the warnings and info they had, the latter is the more compelling reason) it is an example of how the state can abuse your rights for whatever reason.

The last attempt at an ID card system was planned to facilitate the cross referencing of all government departments/public services so that at a push of a button your perfectly normal life can be disrupted or ruined.

And the best bit (as with most of government legislation) is that if they are at fault for a cock-up (or something more sinister) they can't be held to blame!
(Try looking up about those who had their motorcycle licence entitlement withdrawn by error on licence renewal, but had to re-take the test at their own expense)

 

[EFLImpudence]

You can argue all you like, but as soon as you obtain a birth certificate you are in fact effectively 'owned' by the state.

I did cry and say I didn't want one but no one understood.