I'm basing this on evidence. That you have seen enough predictions doesn't make them wrong.
I'm basing this on evidence. That you have seen enough predictions doesn't make them wrong.
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Which ones would they be?
A good example is emission limits. Like most EU regs, it goes out to consultation to those stakeholders throughout the EU that are affected by it. Comments are made, questionnaires are filled out, and people can go and participate in the decision process. I have sat in seminars where it is pointed out that we can't moan about new limits if we don't have a representative there to fight our corner.
They are not put together by some faceless official. They are put together by working groups, and if you're a stakeholder in that sector, you get to have a say.
Well when we leave, we will have no say in these limits, or any other EU law. And on the whole, we will still have to abide by them.
What was that you were saying about sovereignty? Oh yes, you'll get it back... apart from the fact that we'll have less of it, as we'll have less control over these new regs.
So you see, this idea that we will have sovereignty is a nebulous concept. It is born of ideology, rather than practicality.
And it will cost us.
Only when dealing with the EU. Which most people don't. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Besides, if the EU is as wonderful as you say, then it's not likely to implement crippling laws anyway. It was different when it was only half a dozen nations, but not now. There's no need for yet another voice among a 27-strong comittee.
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some of the EU laws / directives have been most welcome tbh
condensing boilers for starters , that created a shed load of work & still is
boilers that were put in a few year's ago are now coming up for renewal
the day of having a boiler chugging away in your house for 20 plus years is long gone £££££££££££
joe public will (& is) pay a heavy price for state of the art technology. Than there was the EU circulating pump directive ££££££££
ect ect
the EU energy labelling (fiche) £££££££££££
blimey thinking about it I dunno why I voted out ?? hang on is there not talk about a having another vote ???
condensing boilers for starters , that created a shed load of work & still is
boilers that were put in a few year's ago are now coming up for renewal the day of having a boiler chugging away in your house for 20 plus years is long gone
£££££££££££joe public will (& is) pay a heavy price for state of the art technology. Than there was the EU circulating pump directive
££££££££ect ect
the EU energy labelling (fiche) £££££££££££
blimey thinking about it I dunno why I voted out ?? hang on is there not talk about a having another vote ???
Does this mean 'then' or 'than'?Than there was the EU circulating pump directive
Do you actually know the difference?
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Doggit
But isn't this the central point in the Brexit vote, we can CHOOSE to follow the EU laws, but we won't be forced to.
But I do only too well Wobs, I see the childish simplicity that makes people throw the baby out with the bathwater, and I continuously despair at the quality of people that run the world.
I have been round long enough to know how the whole game of threat, and counter threat gets played, and how each side will posture in the hope of getting their point across.
I could see years ago where the EU was heading, and it's come to pass. The EU model of tying 27 currencies together was always going to be a recipe for disaster as currencies need to float up and down as each country responds to the others that it trades with. I think it was Max Hastings who during the Brexit lead up, said that we should vote to stay in, and wait about 10 years for the Euro and therefore the EU, to fail, but by getting out now, we will have the chance to build up trade with other countries so that we can ride out the coming upheaval. China used to be the place for cheap labour, but their economy grew, and now Thailand is the next country to go through the process, just as India did before China mechanised itself. Each country goes through a growth, and then a stagnation process, and then the cycle moves around the world. Our economy is built on sand, in that we are selling our business's to overseas investors, and chancellors like Osborne and Brown, caused growth through debt.
I've seen our national debt grow from 0.5 trillion in 2005, to 1trillion in 2011, and now it's reached 1.65trillion, and if we don't get out from under the control of the EU, and build our own prosperity, we will have a hell of a crash in the years to come.
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Doggit
Good ol' Private Eye
And that should have read Good old ONS, which is another institution that doesn't know what it's talking about. It's not invoking article 50 that stops us trading tariff free with the EU, it's the actual exit in the event of not having secured a favourable arrangement. Hang on, didn't the ONS predict Armageddon if we voted for Brexit.
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blightymam
Sorry Doggit, I think you're taking Private Eye too seriously It's just a lighthearted satirical mag. Just thought I'd put it on here because the fact we've not left yet keeps being mentioned and well, PE is rather good at times!
It's just a lighthearted satirical mag. Just thought I'd put it on here because the fact we've not left yet keeps being mentioned and well, PE is rather good at times!
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Doggit
Sorry Blighty, part of my Aspergers issue, I take things too literally. I can now see that they're making fun of the ONS.
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blightymam
No worries Mister
Are you really that naïve?
When we suffer economically as a country from Brexit, it will affect the whole country. When the banking crisis hit, did it just effect the banks? No. The economy is interconnected.
Eg. When investment dries up in the car industry, the suppliers will suddenly struggle to find new trade. Those supply companies will suffer, as will their suppliers and employees..........
We don't live in isolation. Although there are those that wish we did.
Life isn't black & white. There have been EU laws where we have negotiated special deals about, and post-Brexit we'll lose that ability. The EU currently has some of the strictest rules for safety, health & environment in the world. This has come about through a great deal of consultation, and discussion. And we are a 1 in 10 voice, so we are a far louder voice than many believe.
In short: We have shot ourselves in the foot.
Give an example where it was essential that we were part of the negotiation.
What's your point? If we're outside the EU then we won't have to abide by those crippling rules (domestically). Or we can continue to copy the EU rules because they seem sensible. Our choice.
You seem to be saying that countries can't have profitable relations together without also having enforced legal harmonisation. It's like saying two people cannot live happily together without being officially married! What's more, you're saying only European countries are worth marrying...
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It will be: Follow the rules or economic suicide. Which would you choose?
I hope you don't claim to know how the research sector works, better than the scientists who actually deal with this area? As it is they who have made that point.
But we weren't in the Euro. We have the best of both worlds, and we've just thrown it away. It is the UK's own policies that have caused that debt. As you say, Brown and Osbourne's policies, the banking crisis, easy credit etc. have brought on the problems. To blame the EU (even with its faults) is folly.
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