Spanish to start making claims over Gibraltar in trade talks

[JohnD]

When Spain wanted to join the EU, and we were members, with a veto, we insisted they stop claiming Gibraltar before letting them join, and our fellow-members of the EU supported us.

No surprise.

Now we've resigned, and Spain is a member, their fellow-members will support them.

No surprise.

 

[transam]

at what cost ?

 

[fillyboy]

The withdrawal act that Johnson agreed, disproves your theory.

Johnson capitulated and agreed a deal the EU offered 18 months previously.

Oh you do crack me up sometimes Notchy.

 

[Notch7]

Oh you do crack me up sometimes Notchy.

Johnson threw NI under a bus and accepted the EUs deal that was such a bad deal even Theresa May rejected it.

 

[fillyboy]

Johnson threw NI under a bus and accepted the EUs deal that was such a bad deal even Theresa May rejected it.

There is a huge amount of difference between the two deals, and the boris deal is far better.

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/...sons-brexit-deal-is-better-than-theresa-mays/

Boris Johnson managed to defy his critics today and reach a Brexit deal with the European Union. The new agreement updates the Northern Ireland protocol of Theresa May’s Withdrawal Agreement and the Political Declaration, which deals with the future relationship. But while the rest of the deal appears to be unchanged, Boris has succeeded in winning some key concessions from the EU.

Here are five reasons why Boris’s deal is better than May’s:

1. The backstop is gone

Firstly, the backstop that Theresa May negotiated with the EU has been replaced by a new Northern Ireland Protocol and the UK-wide Customs Union in the backstop has been removed completely. Northern Ireland will remain in the UK’s customs territory, which means its people will be able to benefit from any trade deals brokered by the UK after the transition period ends. The territorial sovereignty of the UK is kept intact and the country will have one common external tariff with the rest of the world (although goods coming into NI destined for the EU will pay the EU’s external tariff).


The downside for Northern Ireland is that the region will have to remain, as before, inside the EU’s regulatory orbit for goods, to allow its border with the Republic of Ireland to remain open. Northern Ireland will remain aligned with the EU, and some checks may take place for goods travelling between Northern Ireland and Great Britain.

But…

2. Northern Ireland can leave if it wants

In Theresa May’s Withdrawal Agreement, the UK and Northern Ireland could only break away from the backstop as long as the EU agreed on alternative arrangements. As the EU would have no incentive to do this, May’s agreement essentially meant that the UK and NI would either have to remain inside the Single Market and Customs Union, or risk being trapped in the backstop forever.

In Boris Johnson’s deal, if Northern Ireland wants to leave the arrangement set out above, it can do so with a vote in the Stormont Assembly held every four years. The future of Northern Ireland will now be decided in Belfast, not Brussels. The DUP would not have a veto over this process, which explains its disappointment at the deal.

3. Free trade deals can start on New Year’s Day 2021

Under Boris Johnson’s agreement, the UK will be able to formally begin negotiating trade deals with the rest of the world as soon as the agreement is ratified by parliament. Until now, the uncertainty of the UK’s exit date from the EU has made genuine negotiations with most countries impossible.

But once Boris Johnson’s Withdrawal Agreement is passed, the UK will formally be able to conclude trade talks with the rest of the world. If the UK begins negotiating with the United States in earnest, a Free Trade Deal could be completed as soon as 1 January 2021, when the transition period of the deal ends.

4. Goodbye to the ‘level-playing field’ commitments

Binding commitments for the whole UK to maintain “minimum standards” in the areas of social and environmental policy, tax, competition and state aid have been removed from the withdrawal agreement This is the so-called ‘level playing field,’ a phrase the EU uses to extend its regulatory power over nation states. Whether the UK has to obey these rules or not will instead be decided in the next stage of Brexit talks (negotiations on the “future relationship”), giving the UK greater leverage in the next stage of the talks. This will not, of course, mean a lowering of any standards: the Tory agenda now is about raising standards higher still: new UK laws can replace the old EU ones to underline this point.

5. The UK still takes control of its money, borders and laws

The UK will have left the EU by 31 October 2019. And as soon as the transition period ends, the country will take control of its money, borders and laws. Yes, there’s £33 billion of divorce payments – but we will take back control of the £13 billion a year that we send to the EU, saving at least £70 billion net over the next decade. The UK will have the ability to control its own borders, and if it wishes, end the free movement of people with the European Union, and replace it with its own immigration policy that prioritises and encourages high-skilled people to come and live and work in the UK. This would happen in January 2021.

Now that the backstop has been removed, it also appears that ECJ’s jurisdiction has been massively reduced. The ECJ will still have jurisdiction over EU citizen’s rights for a time-limited period, and over disputes that relate to an interpretation of EU law in the WA. Northern Ireland will also be subject to some ECJ jurisdiction as long as it remains aligned to the EU. But once we leave, the UK will be free to set its own laws, in its own parliament, with its own elected representatives voting on legislation.

 

[Bodd]

Not sure, but they did vote 96% to remain in the EU.

So ...

If that's what they want then let them stay... Their choice

 

[EFLImpudence]

Their choice

Probably not.

 

[Bodd]

Probably not.

Just my opinion. Gibraltar should have a vote if the want to stay British or belong to the Spanish/EU...

 

[Bodd]

he wont give a monkeys about a rock.

I can see what you done there

 

[Notch7]

There is a huge amount of difference between the two deals, and the boris deal is far better

No it isnt, Johnson has put a border inside the United Kingdom
The price of brexit is break up of UK

1. Backstop isnt gone, its embedded in the deal, its the front stop
Anyway, the border is now in Irish sea

2. NI cant leave if it wants to -think about it

3 true trade deals can start....in theory. But in practice the UK can only have a level playing field with EU or USA not both
Nb trade with EU 3X bigger than USA

4.LPF has been moved from WA to PD -semantics, in practice EU will insist on LPF for a trade.

5. Depends on level of trade access.

 

[Mottie]

..

Nb trade with EU 3X bigger than USA

Was that because we were in the EU perhaps?

 

[Notch7]

Bet they don't.

Of course there will be some friction as each nation will have its own domestic interests.

But all 27 will stay united on retaining the integrity of the single market.
There will be no compromise on that.

Dont forget, each EU member state only exports on average 8% of its exports to the UK.
On the other hand the EU represents 45% of UKs market.
We need them more than they nedd us -you will see that play out in the negotiations.

 

[Notch7]

..

Was that because we were in the EU perhaps?

Look up trade gravity

 

[Mottie]

CBA.

 

[Notch7]

CBA.

That is fine.

You must thefefore be happy to accept you are wrong without knowing why.
That is your choice