joe90 & any other holocaust deniers

[joe-90]

The piles of bodies died of Typhus. It was a major problem in the camps which is why they had gas chambers - to disinfect the garments.

That's what the Zyclon B was for.

Tell me Sooey. Will you answer me this question? It's a question that has never been answered by anyone in the past.

It's this:

If the concentration camps were death camps - then why did they keep alive the typhus victims that couldn't work and were useless to the German war effort? Just tell me why.

 

[sooey]

Keep alive as in giving them enough to eat and proper medicine???
Or keep alive as in they hadn't got round to killing those ones just yet?

 

[joe-90]

But they were killed in their millions weren't they? They couldn't have been waiting around that long. It takes a long time to look like they look.
So why did the German's keep them alive?
I guess the reason was - that it was never a death camp.

That's the problem you see. The Holocaust is a giant conspiracy theory - and that means believers will believe anything, no matter how ridiculous.

Oh and of course. There were no death camps on German soil - so that rules out Dachau as being a death camp. Also rules out Buchenwald, or Bergen-Belsen.

Do you see why I'm skeptical? Or would you rather not?

 

[jeds]

Lack of response on the key questions tells the story here. Made up conspiracies based on loose ideas and hunches always fail when the facts get in the way.

 

[joe-90]

I agree. So where are the facts that we are supposed to believe?

 

[bernardgreen]

Buchenwald was not a death camp. It was a labour camp supplying slave labour, never the less about 55,000 died there under the Nazi, most died from hunger, illness or being worked to death. Use Google maps and look to the south of the main camp area. You will find a curved concrete area between two circular earth works. They are mass graves, a third smaller mass grave is located at the middle of the area.


University of Minnesota
http://www.chgs.umn.edu/museum/memorials/buchenwald/

History
Buchenwald, a Nazi concentration camp for political prisoners, was established outside the city of Weimar, Germany in July 1937. Unlike other camps that carried the slogan "Arbeit Macht Frei," Buchenwald's entrance carried the slogan "Jedem das Seine" ("To Each his Own)." At the time of its liberation on April 11, 1945, it contained inmates of 51 nationalities. One of its most famous prisoners was Nobel Prize winner Elie Wiesel. Also included were American POWs. The number of victims is put at 56,545 according to Nazi records on the camp. Buchenwald was not an extermination camp as the camps in occupied Poland. Rather, its main purpose was slave labor. As the area where Buchenwald is found became part of the Soviet occupation zone of Germany and the DDR (Duetsche Demokratische Republik), it was used as camp for anti-Communists until February 10, 1950. Therefore, like several other camps, it has a double history. As many as 22,000 inmates died at Buchenwald under the Soviets.

The number of victims is put at 56,545 according to Nazi records on the camp

 

[bernardgreen]

just realised that Joe, if he bothers to look, might find the new visitors parking area ( this is curved ) and not the Avenue of Nations between the mass graves, He would no doubt use this to "prove" claims of mass graves were just lies.

As I recall it the putrifying bodies and the quick lime in the Nazi built graves leached into the ground water and affected wells and springs in the area. Hence the remains were exhumed and re buied in the mass graves where they would not affect local water supplies.

Untitled

• bernardgreen
• 6 Jun 2015
• 1

 

[joe-90]

The Jews aren't allowed to exhume the dead.

 

[bernardgreen]

The Jews aren't allowed to exhume the dead.

Exhumation is permitted in some extreme circumstances,

I do not know if it was Russians or the puppet East German authorities who relocated the corpses.

One reason you are confused is that West Germany and East Germany had differnt attitudes to the events.

Up to the 1970's the West German government had tried to ignore the Holocaust, they did not deny it, they just didn't talk about it.

The East Germany government ( a puppet government with the Russians pulling the strings ) talked about it. Every member of the German Free Youth had to visit at least one Concentration Camp site before they were 18 so the Holocaust was impressed on every one as a national shame that the Nazi party had created for Germany. To some extent this was Russia's way to get more "revenge" on the Germans for the millions of Russians who died because of the Nazi policies.

Many of the Holocaust denial " facts " come from the attempts by the West German policy to ignore the events.

 

[joe-90]

The Jews aren't allowed to exhume the dead.

Exhumation is permitted in some extreme circumstances,

How convenient. So where were the bodies originally buried? Bearing in mind this is the sort of crowd that a Manchester City game gets. You would need an extraordinarily large hole for that sort of number. So why doesn't it show up on aerial photos of the day? Why is it not visible today? Why did nobody takes any pictures of the corpses being exhumed and reburied? Why has no-one located where they were buried? Why has no-one looked for them?

 

[vinty]

An SS officer tells of his experinece at Auschwtiz:
http://www.spiegel.de/international...the-bookkeeper-from-auschwitz-a-355188-2.html

What did you feel when the Jews were taken to the gas chamber?

"Nothing, I have to say. Because the horrific wasn't obvious. When you know that killing is going on, you also know that people are dying. The horrors only dawned on me when I heard the screams."

Someone who has even taken on Holocaust Deniers, who is even facing trial himself:

http://www.dw.de/the-case-against-t...18392020?maca=en-rss-en-all-1573-rdf[/QUOTE]I think the the bloke you are referring to is called Groening or something similar ,he is 93 and was in a nursing home he had been telling this story for years ,no one ever took him seriously but it seems as real war criminals are getting a bit thin on the ground they are starting to scrape the barrel ,if you read his full testimony you will see that he is not firing on all cylinders,at his age he seems to have symptoms of dementia.

 

[vinty]

Another fact people may not be aware of is that the allies had been intercepting German radio transmissions from the so called death camps, these intercepts have been declassified and are probably available on the net, out of thousands. of intercepts which were sent to Berlin which included the numbers of deaths from all causes there are no references to mass gassings.

 

[vinty]

Another interesting fact is that extermination plots and gas chambers predate WW2 ,

During WW1 British propaganda started feeding stories of German atrocities into the news chain.

These included alleged eye witness accounts of Austrian and Bulgarian troops forcing Serbian civilians into barns and churches and "asphyxiating"them with diabolical machines.

Another story which was circulated was the German corpse factory yarn,supposedly according to the usual "eye witness"the Germans were rendering their own war dead down for soap and fertiliser.

After the war the British put their hands up and admitted they had made the whole thing up,propaganda is a powerfull weapon if used correctly.

In the run up to the Iraq war Tony Blair speaking in the house of commons claimed that there were 400,000 Iraqis in mass graves victims of Saddam he said.After the invasion he admitted it wasn't true,as usual he tried to shift the blame onto the security services for passing him did information

 

[mikeey84]

Look, as with all major historical events, the version printed in the history textbooks probably isn't 100% correct. There are lots of shades of gray.

There will always be people who don't believe the "official" accounts, and pick on the evidence that doesn't seem to add up (jet fuel wont melt steel beams)

Also people jump on any lack of evidence (incomplete fossil record) and trumpet it as conclusive proof of their beliefs, even if there are (reasonable to most people) explanations as to why this evidence is missing.

In this argument (as with all arguments in history) there are at least 2 sides, and nothing the other side will ever say will convince you are wrong.

Joe et al, I am pretty sure nothing you will say will convince some of the people on this board that the holocaust didn't happen broadly in line with historical accounts.

Likewise, there is (obviously from your posts) no piece of evidence that will convince you to change your opinions.

Anyway, I`m sure this won't stop this argument, but wanted to put my two penneth in.

 

[jeds]

The evidence that something wrong happened are the records and documents of the day. Letters' reports, diaries etc. These aren't influenced by propaganda or historical recollection, they were written when the events were happening and are proof the Nazis were murdering, cremating and disposing of people on a large scale. There's no explanation for why these documents exist other than they are recording the truth. The conspiracy theorists on the other hand have no proof at all. Everything they claim is based on unsubstantiated theory. So it's 100% certain proof vs not really got any proof, just an idea. Which would you go with?