Pound in biggest monthly fall against the dollar since 2016...

[wellyfish]

It is hyperinflation. My (and everybody else's) gas bill has tripled in the last few weeks due to the cost of covid.

£s come from trade and industry, nowhere else. Nowhere else apart from crime that is - swindlers such as Ritchie Sunak and Gordon Brown.

Yes you can create as many £s as you like by fiat, but that does not mean that you should.

No, trade and industry don't create £s, they swap them for goods and services.
Can you create £s? Can your neighbour?
Nope. You can't, your neighbour can't, trade and industry can't.
So, where do £s come from?

What does that mean?

Neoliberalism is the ideology that promotes among other things "free markets" (there's no such thing), small state, privatise everything policies.

Monetarist means she thinks the economy can be controlled by messing about with interest rates. Monetarists see everything as a question of interest rates.

 

[ajohn]

Commons. More here

And updated well past the date they cover.

 

[Vinty]

It is hyperinflation. My (and everybody else's) gas bill has tripled in the last few weeks due to the cost of covid.

£s come from trade and industry, nowhere else. Nowhere else apart from crime that is - swindlers such as Ritchie Sunak and Gordon Brown.

Yes you can create as many £s as you like by fiat, but that does not mean that you should.

Inflation is a good way to cut government debt Andy.
Prices go up but so does VAT receipts, wages going up, means more tax and N.I. for the government to redistibute to those lower down the economic food chain.
Those also at the bottom have a role to play in the economy, as soon they get a wad of cash they head for the nearest pub or bookies and then on their way home they call in at the nearest off licence and load up with more alcohol and fags.
It should be noted that alcohol, fags, and gambling are all highly taxed, so unlike all these rich barstewards who park their money offshore to avoid paying tax the under class contribute proportionately more of their income in tax than the greedy ****s at the top of the food chain.
However back to my point about inflation.

Why inflation makes it easier for government to pay debt - Economics Help

How does inflation affect national debt and bondholders? Unexpected inflation can lead to 'partial default' and reduce real value of bonds. but it risks alienating future investors.

www.economicshelp.org

 

[wellyfish]

Inflation is a good way to cut government debt Andy.

If people understood what 'government debt' actually is then they wouldn't be in such a hurry to 'cut' it.

Prices go up but so does VAT receipts, wages going up, means more tax and N.I. for the government to redistibute to those lower down the economic food chain.

The UK govt doesn't 'redistribute' tax revenues. Tax revenues offset spending, they don't fund it.

It should be noted that alcohol, fags, and gambling are all highly taxed, so unlike all these rich barstewards who park their money offshore to avoid paying tax, the under class contribute proportionately more of their income in tax than the greedy ****s at the top of the food chain.
However back to my point about inflation.

All government spending, except that which is saved (aka The National Debt) is returned to the Exchequer via taxation.

Those that 'park their money offshore' avoid taxation in the first place but, as soon as they start spending it they attract taxation in the same way as everyone else.

 

[Vinty]

is returned to the Exchequer via taxation

That was my point.
The government gives someone £100 and they go out and spend it on alcohol or cigarettes, the shop keeper makes a profit which he pays tax on, the government also collects the tax on tobacco.

 

[Vinty]

Those that 'park their money offshore' avoid taxation in the first place but, as soon as they start spending it they attract taxation in the same way as everyone else

So if someone goes abroad and buys an old piece of canvas with paint on it for £50 million quid because he believes its a masterpiece and the art dealer has told him its an investment, when does he start paying tax on that £50 million quid.

 

[wellyfish]

That was my point.
The government gives someone £100 and they go out and spend it on alcohol or cigarettes, the shop keeper makes a profit which he pays tax on, the government also collects the tax on tobacco.

... and the shopkeeper pays his bills and staff (who then pay tax and spend etc.) & spends his profits and on it goes until it's all been taxed out of the economy - unless people along the way have decided to save some of it.

One person's spending is another person's income.

Important to understand that UK govt doesn't recycle tax revenues and that taxes are effectively the deletion of £s.

 

[wellyfish]

So if someone goes abroad and buys an old piece of canvas with paint on it for £50 million quid because he believes its a masterpiece and the art dealer has told him its an investment, when does he start paying tax on that £50 million quid.

If someone 'went abroad' to buy something it's highly unlikely they would be using £s to buy it. Much more likely they would use the local currency.
When and how they pay tax would depend on the tax regime in the country of purchase and the tax and duty applicable if and when they brought their purchase back to the UK.

 

[Vinty]

When and how they pay tax would depend on the tax regime in the country of purchase and the tax and duty applicable if and when they brought their purchase back to the UK

So what happens if the bloke who buys the oil painting for £50 million decides to keep his purchase locked up in a vault as an investment rather than bring it back to the UK, when does he pay taxes on his £50 million.

 

[wellyfish]

So what happens if the bloke who buys the oil painting for £50 million decides to keep his purchase locked up in a vault as an investment rather than bring it back to the UK, when does he pay taxes on his £50 million.

Well, if he's gone to France to buy it then he's had to exchange enough £s to get hold of the €s he needs to make the purchase.
If he's gone to USA then it's the same but with $.
In either case, once he's exchanged his £s for the currency he needs (€ or $) he no longer has those £s, someone else does.

 

[ajohn]

So what happens if the bloke who buys the oil painting for £50 million decides to keep his purchase locked up in a vault as an investment rather than bring it back to the UK, when does he pay taxes on his £50 million.

Various things can be used to avoid capital gains tax. Once something has gone that way they create their own market. CArs have figured - rare ones often due to age. I wonder about antiques having bought something from the USA and finding there was no import duty to pay. Why exclude them sort of conspiracy theory.

Welly iis ranting about something related that I came across on the parliament channel purely via a fluke - deciding to switch to it. A speech. A man sells something and makes £10 profit. He spends that and some one else makes £2 profit and sells that so some one else makes a profit......... The speaker said he had seen the maths and mentioned how wonderful they were. Made me laugh as he total up all of the profit and from memory it came to something approaching £15. Magic money and life is not as simple as that. The £10 man profit for instance needs to restock. If there is inflation that restocking will cost more than the previous one. One of my uncles ran a shop, groceries and did well. His accountant suggest he should buy another and suggested an iron mungers. Stock hangs around and prices increase - money for nothing after a fashion but not that simple in practice but the accountant had a valid point.

 

[wellyfish]

Various things can be used to avoid capital gains tax. Once something has gone that way they create their own market. CArs have figured - rare ones often due to age. I wonder about antiques having bought something from the USA and finding there was no import duty to pay. Why exclude them sort of conspiracy theory.

Welly iis ranting about something related that I came across on the parliament channel purely via a fluke - deciding to switch to it. A speech. A man sells something and makes £10 profit. He spends that and some one else makes £2 profit and sells that so some one else makes a profit......... The speaker said he had seen the maths and mentioned how wonderful they were. Made me laugh as he total up all of the profit and from memory it came to something approaching £15. Magic money and life is not as simple as that. The £10 man profit for instance needs to restock. If there is inflation that restocking will cost more than the previous one. One of my uncles ran a shop, groceries and did well. His accountant suggest he should buy another and suggested an iron mungers. Stock hangs around and prices increase - money for nothing after a fashion but not that simple in practice but the accountant had a valid point.

Ranting, lol.

You have absolutely zero idea of even the very basics of how the money system works but thanks for providing me with some really good laughs.

 

[ajohn]

You have absolutely zero idea of even the very basics of how the money system works

More correctly you think you do. Some of your posts recently have even been pedantic. Argue when the person you are arguing with just put things a different way. I am cleverer etc. One suggestion you mentioned is infantile and has very obvious problems. Then you throw in conspiracy as a reason for not going that way.

Solutions - you do not have a clue or understand the problems.

 

[wellyfish]

More correctly you think you do. Some of your posts recently have even been pedantic. Argue when the person you are arguing with just put things a different way. I am cleverer etc. One suggestion you mentioned is infantile and has very obvious problems. Then you throw in conspiracy as a reason for not going that way.

Solutions - you do not have a clue or understand the problems.

You are ranting.
Ok, here's your chance.
Explain how the money system, particularly govt fiscal ops, works in the UK.
Reference any legislation and process you think will support your position.

Be as specific as you can.

The floor is yours, off you go!

 

[ajohn]

Explain how the money system, particularly govt fiscal ops, works in the UK.

Pointless. The general Tory aim as always is to cut the fiscal load and boost the economy and raise more that way. They have other favourites too.

So you provide the info you ask for everyone to read.

One strawman post deserves another in reply.