Rewire or not to rewire?

[ColJack]

yes it depends on the property, but as an average a man and a mate should be able to bash out a 3 bed semi in a week..

this does not include the finish plastering though..

 

[iCraig]

What plastering is required?

As all I can see in the house I have is 2 wall lights that probably would need plastering in and the switches I assume?
Although I still don't have a clue how and where the cables go to the second floor so I suppose thats a lot of plastering too?

 

[ColJack]

any extra sockets or switches will need the chases plastered back in and the boxes made good, and there's no guarantee that you can get new wires down the old chases so you may have to chase out to every old socket / switch too.....

 

[flameport]

Unless the house is an unusual design, then plastering would consist of:
- a vertical chase above every light switch and wall light position
- a vertical chase below every socket outlet
- a significantly wider vertical chase both above and below the consumer unit
- possibly horizontal chases between socket outlets in the kitchen, possibly other rooms if there are 2 or more sockets fairly close together.

Additionally, it is likely that replastering will be required around all of the sockets/switches, as the existing old plaster will probably crumble away when the holes are cut into the walls.

Other things to consider:
- floorboards will need to be removed and replaced in all of the upstairs rooms, hallway and probably of the downstairs rooms as well (unless there is a cellar or large space under the ground floor). This is why rewiring an empty property will be far cheaper than one filled with furniture.
- access to the loft space, so if it is stuffed full of junk, best to dispose of all that before any work is started (or pay a lot more to have the electrician move it)
- If the house has carpets you want to keep, you will need to get a carpet fitter in afterwards to fix the carpets back properly.
- If you have laminate flooring, then say goodbye to it. It will be destroyed.
- Due to the replastering, you can expect to have to redecorate every room.

The other comments about PVC wiring lasting a long time are valid, so it is quite likely that the existing wiring is in good condition. However this won't help you at all. By the time extra cabling has been installed for all of the additional sockets and other items, you may as well have the whole lot replaced.

 

[iCraig]

Thanks guys!

I'll get a spark in soon then, although I don't think they'd appreciate if I called them on a bank holiday between Christmas I suppose.

I know some are saying get a PIR done but I think for piece of mind and the fact I have the money now I may aswell get the rewiring done as its not been done since atleast 1987. That and the fact we have several wiring issues with several lights not working and some sockets no longer working. And if I showed you the wiring in the bathroom, I think you'd condemn it without a second look!

Will just have to arrange somewhere to live. Also I notice people mentioning if the house is empty makes it cheaper. Although what can we do about the furniture? Move it all into one room and let them do work in all the other rooms first then take it out and that them do that?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Craig - the advice about recommendations is spot on - it really is aways the best way to find a reputable tradesman, but if you're having to go ahead without much in the way of those, or references, don't put any store by registration itself - sadly it is possible to become registered with woefully inadequate qualifications and zero practical experience. You don't have to spend long here to see people cropping up who are registered and "qualified", but who are clearly seriously incompetent in reality and who should not be charging for their services.

You are looking for someone to rewire a house, and it may surprise and dismay you to learn that it is quite possible to become a "certified electrician" without ever having done that before, and without having acquired any of the practical skills needed to do it without half-destroying your house in the process.

It's your money, £'000s of it, and you have every right to ask prospective tradesmen what their qualifications and experience are. Just being listed here is not a good enough guide. No genuinely experienced electrician, with the "full set" of C&G qualifications will mind you asking - in fact he will wish that everyone was like you.

I feel sorry for people who have been misled by training organisations and (shamefully) the Competent Person scheme organisers into thinking that a 5-day training course, a couple of trivial examples of their work and some basic understanding of how to use test equipment will make them an electrician, but not sorry enough to agree with them trying to sell their services to Joe Public.


Think hard about where to have sockets - it's difficult to have too many, and also about what circuits to have. The items on the list below won't all apply to you, but they are worth thinking about:

• Upstairs sockets
• Downstairs sockets
• Kitchen sockets
• Circuit for appliances
• Cooker circuit
• Non-RCD circuit for F/F
• Non-RCD circuit for CH boiler
• Dedicated circuit for hifi
• Dedicated circuit for IT equipment
• Upstairs lights
• Downstairs lights
• Lighting circuits with switches in the usual places but with 3A/5A round pin sockets at low level.
• Immersion heater
• Loft lights
• Shower
• Bathroom circuit
• Alarms
• Supply for outside lights
• Supply for garden electrics
• Supply for shed/garage

Plus any peculiarities brought about by your house layout & construction - e.g. in mine because of solid floors and where the socket circuits run, I have a radial just for a socket in the hall, the doorbell and the porch lights.

Unless you want to go to the expense of RCBOs throughout, the CU should have at least 3 sections, 2 on RCDs and one not into which you can install a mix of RCBOs and MCBs.

It can be a good idea to put all wiring in conduit for ease of future changes. And if you specify metal conduit for switch drops, or BS 8436 cable it removes the need to have RCDs where you'd rather not.

If you live somewhere where supplies are dodgy in the winter, have the lights, the boiler supply, and a socket in each room wired to a separate CU, or a separate section in a large one, that can be supplied by an emergency generator - lights, heating, TV and a kettle/microwave make life a lot more bearable.

Flood-wiring with Cat6 or Cat6a cable is worth thinking about.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I really don't understand why people seem to think that electrics can be done cheaply, after all you wouldn't let anyone install gas appliances, I know I wouldn't.

//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=254980

 

[iCraig]

//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=254980

I read that and I shouldn't say this but I laughed! Bet he's spent £1000s doing that and got nothing at the end of it.

I want this do be done right and last. The plan is to be able to sell the house in a good condition within 2 years or maybe longer depending on what is decided.

I've already got a couple of local companies in mind to do the work, so I am going to get them to come out for a quote in the new year.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

The plan is to be able to sell the house in a good condition within 2 years or maybe longer depending on what is decided.

Don't go overboard on network cables, steel conduit, dedicated hi-fi circuits etc...

 

[martinxxxxxx]

The plan is to be able to sell the house in a good condition within 2 years or maybe longer depending on what is decided.

Don't go overboard on network cables, steel conduit, dedicated hi-fi circuits etc...

Though if the house I was buying had wiried network, it would be a real plus at not much extra money, but I can see where BAN is coming from.

Just also make sure they are going to put good gear in MK, Crabtree etc not some Screwfix budget crap.

Martin

 

[ElectricianDirect]

Get a PIR done and go from there.

In my experience if you are have a load of building work/ modernisation done then this is probably the time to get a rewire done too. I agree that up grading the consumer unit would be a good way of making the PIR pay for itself (assuming you use a registered, recommended electrician who will agree to do a full pir as part of the job)

The only reservation I have is the fact that you wish to live in the house while it is done. I hate to say this but you may be better off using a bigger firm than a one man band who can throw numbers at the job and do it in a week. But be warned it is a messy business. Mind you ElectricianDirect is up your way and according to his blurb he can do it for a snip with no mess either.

Martin

Cheers Martin

Not a "snip" but very reasonable on the rate side

Minimum disruption i.e. lifting floorboard at either side of room and drilling access holes if outlets required on walls where floor boards haven't been lifted.

Not no mess - any mess created cleaned as job proceeds... Room-by-room undertaking back filling of back boxes / chases...

The trouble with throwing a lot of labour at an occupied job is the labour needs to be able to get on with something, hence floor boards up everywhere, carpets rolled or folded in whatever manner possible... A recipe for disaster.

I've got to issue an electrical certificate for a job in Salford, so it may be possible to drop in for a look. Fortunately, I have a excellent Mate in Manchester as well as a good heating engineer / plumber.

Spending £5k on a new kitchen seems OTT on the basis the property is going up for sale... Whoever buys will rip out whatever to put their own mark on the property. Who buys the properties in the area? From day 1 whatever's done should be aimed at the potential buyers!

Steel conduits and trunking...? Mannn-O-mannnnnnnnn... Ain't nobody heard of that new fangled stuff called PVC? I always try to picture the entrance to a home and "yes" I'd rec some decent lighting in this area to make the entrance warm and welcoming.

 

[ElectricianDirect]

What plastering is required?

As all I can see in the house I have is 2 wall lights that probably would need plastering in and the switches I assume?
Although I still don't have a clue how and where the cables go to the second floor so I suppose thats a lot of plastering too?

Craig... There's lot's of ways to get cables upstairs and without lots of damage. This, I suppose, could be considered the art of such (rather than the house-bashing approach)

 

[martinxxxxxx]

Steel conduits and trunking...? Mannn-O-mannnnnnnnn... Ain't nobody heard of that new fangled stuff called PVC?

Happy to help, thought you might be along at some point.

I think the only reason that steel conduit is mentioned here is to aid the avoidance of RCD on fridge-freezer dedicated feed and perhaps the same for the lighting. Plastic would not achieve this characteristic should it be desired. (which it probably isn't since OP is planning to sell in couple of years)

Happy New Year to you hope it is a prosperous one too.

Martin

 

[iCraig]

Not a "snip" but very reasonable on the rate side

Minimum disruption i.e. lifting floorboard at either side of room and drilling access holes if outlets required on walls where floor boards haven't been lifted.

Not no mess - any mess created cleaned as job proceeds... Room-by-room undertaking back filling of back boxes / chases...

The trouble with throwing a lot of labour at an occupied job is the labour needs to be able to get on with something, hence floor boards up everywhere, carpets rolled or folded in whatever manner possible... A recipe for disaster.

I've got to issue an electrical certificate for a job in Salford, so it may be possible to drop in for a look. Fortunately, I have a excellent Mate in Manchester as well as a good heating engineer / plumber.

Spending £5k on a new kitchen seems OTT on the basis the property is going up for sale... Whoever buys will rip out whatever to put their own mark on the property. Who buys the properties in the area? From day 1 whatever's done should be aimed at the potential buyers!

Steel conduits and trunking...? Mannn-O-mannnnnnnnn... Ain't nobody heard of that new fangled stuff called PVC? I always try to picture the entrance to a home and "yes" I'd rec some decent lighting in this area to make the entrance warm and welcoming.

Well if your up this way and don't mind dropping in to give me a quote?

I assume your NICEIC/Part-P registered? Also the plan is to put money into the house and get it back up to a decent living standard for us with a view to be able to sell, but selling it is not set in stone or decided really. Its just that it'd hard to sell in the condition it is in currently.

PM me your number and I'll give you a call...

Craig

 

[iCraig]

Well the ball is officially rolling, as I now have a couple of sparks coming to see what is required and give me quotes.

Now all I need to decide is what level of protection I want from the CU, do I go for split load or separate RCBOs?

Craig