Should billionaires and multinationals pay fair tax?

[motorbiking]

That's not the way prices work.

Wrong. But you know this.

 

[motorbiking]

The U.K. has a massive problem with wealth inequality
The U.K. has terrible public services
The average person has poor living standards.
The cause is wealthy people accumulating assets and the poor losing assets


What is your solution to this?
Or don’t you want a solution?

Seriously, you need to go and travel the world, to see just how good we have it.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

Sorry to hear you're leaving the village.

Anyways, down to business. We've had two offers on your beautiful home. One is from a young local couple, they really like it and have offered £340k. So a fair bit below its surveyed value however that's their absolute upper limit. The second offer is from an out of town couple, they really like your property and have offered £460k. The market's a bit slow at present so we don't know if we'll get any more offers to be honest.

I know you're keen to sell asap, so what offer do you want to accept?

 

[denso13]

I know you're keen to sell asap, so what offer do you want to accept?

What a stupid question.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

No it does not

First time buyers often get a studio flat, then they might buy a 1 bedroom flat, then a middle terrace

Exactly

 

[aveatry]

What is your solution to this?

Nothing because there is not a problem - unless you are a Marxist

 

[carmanmemoranda]

People make me laugh when they bleat on about housing and the value of property, primarily the fact that values increase, sometimes exponentially.

What do these people actually want to happen? We either have a free market approach to property or we don't.

Do these people want some sort of cap implemented through legislation? e.g. the value of any individual property cannot increase by more than x% per year and cannot be sold for more than this value. Is that the desired solution? So how would that be administered? One could simply offer the seller a separate wad of cash to secure the sale.

Let's say the authorities actually get their finger out and build enough houses, including social houses. That doesn't preclude values continuing to increase in certain areas e.g. where the property is highly desired regardless of the quantity of other properties in that locality.

And, although some will be reluctant to admit it, it can be a different scenario if you end up benefitting from such a situation. e.g. someone buys a house for £250k x years back then puts it on the market because they're relocating. It's now worth £420k. They're downsizing to a property costing £300k. So do these highly principled people say to the estate agent 'I don't need to realise anything over £300k for my house, so please just put it on the market for £300k.'

It's like the people who live in small (usually coastal) towns and villages moaning about second home owners and/or the fact locals can no longer afford to buy in the area.

Emmm, at some point a LOCAL has sold their property to a non local and been quite happy to accept more dosh for it That point they're not quite so keen to shout about.

Double standards abound when it comes to the subject of property, unless you have left wing socialist leanings and don't own a property, deeming everyone that does to be 'rich' and 'essentially a piece of free market capitalist scum.'

Or. You own a property (or 2) but recognise that prices are now out of reach of people that want to buy.

That's not a good long term model for any sensible society.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

What a stupid question.

Far from a stupid question. If the seller wants to do the principled thing, they'd surely sell to the young couple, no?

Do you know anyone who thinks it's disgusting, absolutely disgusting, that top footballers can earn hundreds of thousands a week?

Let's say one of them has a young son who's great at football. x years later the son is offered a pro contract earning him hundreds of thousands per week.

Does the dad advise his son to accept the contract on the proviso the salary is cut by 75% to a level that is morally correct and principled?

We are FULL of double standards in life, usually linked to whether or not we're directly affected by something.

 

[denso13]

they'd surely sell to the young couple, no?

No. People have all sorts of different principles.

Do you know anyone who thinks it's disgusting, absolutely disgusting, that top footballers can earn hundreds of thousands a week?

Yes.

Does the dad advise his son to accept the contract on the proviso the salary is cut by 75% to a level that is morally correct and principled?

No, another daft question.

Governments run the country and set policy, that's where the blame lies, not with individuals.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Seriously, you need to go and travel the world, to see just how good we have it.

Like Europe maybe?

 

[Notch7]

Nothing because there is not a problem - unless you are a Marxist

The evidence says there is a problem



Just because you deny there is a problem or because you lack the ability to understand the problem does not mean it doesn’t exist.

Here is the evidence:

1) “Wealth inequality is high and rising and more marked than income inequality. In the UK, the bottom 50% of the population owned less than 5% of wealth in 2021, and the top 10% a staggering 57% (up from 52.5% in 1995). The top 1% alone held 23% (World Inequality Lab, 2022).”

Changing the narrative on wealth inequality

New approaches to framing wealth inequality as a social problem could build political pressure for change.

www.jrf.org.uk

2) “Comparing this with previous housing market data, we can see that homeownership rates have decreased considerably over the last few years. In fact, in the two years from 2016 to 2018, 63% owned their own homes. 28% of Brits own their home outright”

Aveatry, if home ownership levels are dropping that means assets are moving from wages to capital (ie wealthy are gaining assets)

40+ Home Ownership Statistics for the UK in 2024

All the latest facts and figures on homeownership in 2024, from average house prices to the most in-demand cities and attributes prospective homeowners look for

www.avanthomes.co.uk

3) “Britain’s toxic combination of low growth and high inequality has left it trailing behind the comparable economies of Australia, Canada, France, Germany and the Netherlands, with disastrous consequences for low- and middle-income households.”

Average UK families £8,800 a year worse off than in comparable countries - Nuffield Foundation

Britain’s toxic combination of low growth and high inequality has left it trailing behind...

www.nuffieldfoundation.org

4) Income inequality in the UK is high compared to most developed countries

Income and wealth inequality explained in 5 charts | Institute for Fiscal Studies

We document how economic inequalities have changed over the last sixty years, and how experiences have varied for different groups.

ifs.org.uk

5) “last year the lowest-earning bracket of British households had a standard of living that was 20 per cent weaker than their counterparts in Slovenia”

Britain and the US are poor societies with some very rich people​

Britain and the US are poor societies with some very rich people

When it comes to average household incomes, the UK may soon need to ask migrant labourers to take a pay cut

www.ft.com

Aveatry please provide the evidence that shows it is not a problem

 

[Notch7]

Seriously, you need to go and travel the world, to see just how good we have it.

Seriously you need to go and see some poor people and see how sh1t life is in this country

And yes I have travelled, I’ve been to plenty of European countries which have higher standards of living, better public services than the UK


I conclude you don’t want things to better.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

No. People have all sorts of different principles.

Yes.

No, another daft question.

Governments run the country and set policy, that's where the blame lies, not with individuals.

I see you don't have a good response to any of my facts. Which is fine, because the masses don't like to admit, for all their pontificating, the solidity of their moralistic and principled pov will often change if they themselves are in a position to benefit from something.

Tom: I think the average CEO wage is nothing short of disgusting!!!

(10 years later)

Board Chair: Tom, we'd like you to be our new CEO, basic salary of £400k pa plus benefits taking it to a value of £750k pa, okay?
Tom: <insert what we think Tom says to the offer ...>



Btw using my football scenario, government don't set policy around wages, although perhaps you'd like them to? Along with setting policy around more restrictive property sales in terms of selling price etc.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

I see you don't have a good response to any of my facts. Which is fine, because the masses don't like to admit, for all their pontificating, the solidity of their moralistic and principled pov will often change if they themselves are in a position to benefit from something.

Tom: I think the average CEO wage is nothing short of disgusting!!!

(10 years later)

Board Chair: Tom, we'd like you to be our new CEO, basic salary of £400k pa plus benefits taking it to a value of £750k pa, okay?
Tom: <insert what we think Tom says to the offer ...>



Btw using my football scenario, government don't set policy around wages, although perhaps you'd like them to? Along with setting policy around more restrictive property sales in terms of selling price etc.

None of that challenges the points made

 

[denso13]

Tom: I think the average CEO wage is nothing short of disgusting!!!

(10 years later)

Board Chair: Tom, we'd like you to be our new CEO, basic salary of £400k pa plus benefits taking it to a value of £750k pa, okay?
Tom: <insert what we think Tom says to the offer ...>

Another stupid argument.

Btw using my football scenario, government don't set policy around wages, although perhaps you'd like them to?

Don't be silly.

Along with setting policy around more restrictive property sales in terms of selling price etc.

More nonsense. There should be a proper house building strategy including affordable housing. Too many people can't get on the property ladder, it doesn't have to be that way.