Someone is trying to start a war in the Ukraine, It's NOT Russia (edit: yes it is)

ajohn said:
What I heard was talking about doing it from some German person. Much as mentioned inc helmets. Not sky. An interview on the beeb.

I mentioned a phone video of street fighting. Hope to see it again but thought that doesn't look very exciting. Then saw molotofs being made and though mmm a couple of those far apart might explain what it showed. Pass at the moment.

Huge shell lying in a street - did some one drag it there?

Turkey shutting off black sea access. The deal on that allows Russian access. Would Turkey take on Russia?

There's more but need to look again.

I did get the flats wrong as 3 damaged. ;) Sorry.
Click to expand...

as I understand it under some treaty they could only shut off access if they define the conflict as a war

words and definitions can be played with ???

would the Turks take on the Russians ? They have had some confrontations with them in Syria ect
The question may be
Would the Russians take on Turkey
A nato member

article 5 would or should automatically be triggered

than it’s curtains
 
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If anyone is interested this is a site i frequent and in this instance an interesting thread related to some of the discussion here.

Some interesting speculations, especially hinting the Russian units are under pressure to penetrate and quickly take over the capital, to their detriment of being overstretched and supply lines being severed.

If the West manage to keep the Ukraine forces topped up with supplies it could be getting uncomfortable for Mr Unpopular. He's bound to win in the end, but at what cost and how long.

https://www.defencetalk.com/military/forums/t/the-ukrainian-donbass-war-thread.15283/
 
Videos online of Russian tanks running out of fuel

??? some bloke stopped in his car and asked if they needed a tow back to Russia
 
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transam said:
as I understand it under some treaty they could only shut off access if they define the conflict as a war
Click to expand...

Do you think the Russian or anyone else would agree to that? Latest from Turkey appears to be that they are thinking about it.

Are you sure that Russia wouldn't strike a warship or what ever that belonged to a NATO member? Putin has suggested he will. Just like his mig that was shot down due to the direction it came from. ;) That's the official reason anyway.

India are trying to get some students out. They are not trying to fly into Ukraine as it's a no fly zone. Doubt if anyone else will either. Maybe the USA and UK will fly arms in. I wouldn't hold your breath but maybe - who knows but they may find no where to land.

I didn't check who the German was but would bet he is a politician that has no effective power. The official response from Germany has been 3 eurofighters.

As some reporters are saying all they are receiving is reports and propaganda and aren't in a position to see what is actually happening.

Germany and it's gas is only part of the gas problem but Germany is a popular one to mention. Merkel mentioned but in fact early on she was against it but the rest wanted it. Curiously she isn't a dictator who can't just say no. Germany dropping nuclear too soon seems to be down to parties in power problems. Nuke bad, gas better. It has to come from some where and a number of countries need it for the same reason.

SWIFT is nothing other than a bank messaging service. It's secure and carries details of where money is coming from and where it's going to. It doesn't move anything at all. There are ways around it. Where things get difficult is spending GBP, USD and Euro how ever it's done where banks comply.

The Russians have satellites too. Given where some of the action is they appear to be using them. Plus the BBC found a convoy on it's way to Kiev. It included a anti aircraft missile set up with it's top neatly blown to bits. At least one truck too. Re arming them even more ammo is seen as being tricky.

One thing for sure the Ukrainian public expect the west to stop the attack - now.
 
transam said:
Videos online of Russian tanks running out of fuel

??? some bloke stopped in his car and asked if they needed a tow back to Russia
Click to expand...
Yep its all in those threads. SPeculation that coverage of Ukraine are focusing on not directly engaging heavy infantry but instead focused on destroying the supply convoys have contributed to stalling.
 
ajohn said:
Do you think the Russian or anyone else would agree to that? Latest from Turkey appears to be that they are thinking about it.

Are you sure that Russia wouldn't strike a warship or what ever that belonged to a NATO member? Putin has suggested he will. Just like his mig that was shot down due to the direction it came from. ;) That's the official reason anyway.

India are trying to get some students out. They are not trying to fly into Ukraine as it's a no fly zone. Doubt if anyone else will either. Maybe the USA and UK will fly arms in. I wouldn't hold your breath but maybe - who knows but they may find no where to land.

I didn't check who the German was but would bet he is a politician that has no effective power. The official response from Germany has been 3 eurofighters.

As some reporters are saying all they are receiving is reports and propaganda and aren't in a position to see what is actually happening.

Germany and it's gas is only part of the gas problem but Germany is a popular one to mention. Merkel mentioned but in fact early on she was against it but the rest wanted it. Curiously she isn't a dictator who can't just say no. Germany dropping nuclear too soon seems to be down to parties in power problems. Nuke bad, gas better. It has to come from some where and a number of countries need it for the same reason.

SWIFT is nothing other than a bank messaging service. It's secure and carries details of where money is coming from and where it's going to. It doesn't move anything at all. There are ways around it. Where things get difficult is spending GBP, USD and Euro how ever it's done where banks comply.

The Russians have satellites too. Given where some of the action is they appear to be using them. Plus the BBC found a convoy on it's way to Kiev. It included a anti aircraft missile set up with it's top neatly blown to bits. At least one truck too. Re arming them even more ammo is seen as being tricky.

One thing for sure the Ukrainian public expect the west to stop the attack - now.
Click to expand...

Doubt the Russians would be happy

dunno what you mean by

doubt the Russians would agree :confused:

doubt they would :idea:

afaik said treaty dates back over 60 years ????

other than that I did not read all
Yer post ( to long) I have a short attention span
 
transam said:
Doubt the Russians would be happy

dunno what you mean by

doubt the Russians would agree :confused:

doubt they would :idea:

afaik said treaty dates back over 60 years ????

other than that I did not read all
Yer post ( to long) I have a short attention span
Click to expand...

I've got a nuclear bunker (back bedroom), I'll pencil in you and Skippy, not enough room on the drive for yer cars though,.
 
transam said:
Doubt the Russians would be happy

dunno what you mean by

doubt the Russians would agree :confused:

doubt they would :idea:

afaik said treaty dates back over 60 years ????

other than that I did not read all
Yer post ( to long) I have a short attention span
Click to expand...

Turkey are a large importer of Russian gas
 
Some impressive detail stats and coverage coming out of this horrible war if you know where to look.

This chap has a good understanding and a fascinating insight into Russias movements so far. Dare I say happens time over in so many large commercial establishments where the chiefs are so far detached from the front lines it all goes horrible wrong. I hope he's right and they truly are suffering logistical issues after spending so much time posturing on the boarder

https://twitter.com/delfoo/status/1497498201527521281?t=DhJjPMCeX-gXuZOnhI78sg&s=19
 
I do hope he's right. There is a lot coverage on instagram (of all places) and frankly, I think Russia is decimating Ukraine.:(
If Ukraine can keep getting resupply of western weapons and they can cut off the Russian resupply, they may have a chance of forcing Putin to negotiation on the basis he finally realises he can't win. Currently, I think Putin has the upper hand.
 
Good morning ladies

Let us remind you of the important facts.

Both sides lie, exaggerate and bluff as do all other nations who have endured war, dislike of the other, fact.

The figures Ukraine are providing up to 3500 Russian troops dead. This figure is massively overstated there
is no evidence to substantiate this or anything close to this. However, one death is too many.

Ukrainian dead, no real figures to trust as yet but my calculations are about, up to 250 since 17-00 hours yesterday inc possibly
20 odd civilians, as stated before, one death is one too much.

No doubt in my mind, Russian troops have been careful not to attack civilian targets/infrastructure but accidents do happen a fact of war.
Russian may target more widely as/if they get hemmed down as do all nations.

Heads up: Russia has offered talks in Beluras or whatever it is called and Ukraine's leader has refused and IMO he should have
taken it up and see what was on offer as every second that passes leads to more deaths.

Yesterday and I posted the facts, Ukraine's leader lied about Turkey agreeing to block the straits. However, the Russian leader is almost a complete liar.

Caution advised re videos on youtube/twitter, especially where they are old from another country etc. Warning, at times the pics you see are real but
the backstory is not talked about and may be lied about


i feel for the people that have lost their homes/lives and are now without family/friends/etc not knowing what is happening next. I feel for the majority of Russian soldiers most are conscripts and joined up for a job and most are not prepared to fight. A lot more seems to be refusing to leave the other side of the border as they hear stories of real fighting and many have just walked away. Sadly, in war soldiers will get shot by their own leaders if they refuse orders depending on who their commanders are. Like Ukrainian troops and citizens, I'm sure these Russian soldiers would fight if they were protecting their motherland like the Ukrainians but they are being led by a self obsessed, evil person/Putin


NB: Please feel free to abuse me, lie about my posts and post them out of context in an edited version as parasites do.

Peace and love.
 
Incredible claims that need to be verified as no real evidence via pictures. If true/verified, I hope more Russian troops and the public turn on Putin.

In the link below, a "hospital being shelled" the story was "rebuffed by the NY Times." (In war as explained many times, the truth is always the first casualty)

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ery-bombardment-leaving-pulsing-glow-sky.html

The sooner this ends the better for all of us.

My sources in Russia are citing that this may be there is a chance to remove Putin. I hope so.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ery-bombardment-leaving-pulsing-glow-sky.html
 
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