The real problem with the EU is whose in control.

[Himaginn]

What you actually said was:

Pure fiction. Tax rates are decided by individual members. Look it up before making silly statements. Oops silly me, that's not how the Out-ers present their case.

But now you admit that individual members are not free to decide their own tax rates, because they are bound by the limits the EU imposes.

It was not in isolation as you like to present it. It was in reply to ajs:

When they can dictate how our vat system is run and the rate at which it is applied (as they will soon be doing with our tax system)

Pure fiction. Tax rates are decided by individual members. Look it up before making silly statements. Oops silly me, that's not how the Out-ers present their case.

The fact that I omitted that VAT is set in certain ranges is a minute point. Under the circumstances it was a valid comment in response to ajs.
EU do not dictate the VAT rate applied. They set a range in which countries are free to set their own.

So individual members are free to set their own rates within a set range. That rate is not set by EU as ajs stated.

 

[ajstoneservices]

http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/common/infringements/case_law/index_en.htm

 

[Himaginn]

Incidentally the ruling hasn't been applied yet.

I told you that as well. April's finance bill. August it comes into force.

You did? Where?

The UK government said https://www.gov.uk/tax-on-shopping/energy-saving-products

In 2012, the European Commission commenced infraction proceedings against the UK claiming that its application of the reduced rate for the installation of energy saving materials was not in accordance with EU law.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...r-the-installation-of-energy-saving-materials

 

[PBC_1966]

The fact that I omitted that VAT is set in certain ranges is a minute point

Not really, when you're trying to suggest that member countries are free to set their own rates. And how about things which the EU says must be exempt? Member countries are not free to charge any tax on those.

 

[ajstoneservices]

That rate is not set by EU as ajs stated.

That rate cannot be set by the UK as you stated.

 

[Himaginn]

http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/common/infringements/case_law/index_en.htm

What is this for?

 

[ajstoneservices]

For a rainy day.

 

[Himaginn]

Not really, when you're trying to suggest that member countries are free to set their own rates. And how about things which the EU says must be exempt? Member countries are not free to charge any tax on those.

Like what?
And what is the implications of this?

That rate cannot be set by the UK as you stated.

It is set at a specific point and varied up or down within limits, by individual countries. Contrary to your assertion that EU dictates the rate. It does not. It sets the range!

 

[PBC_1966]

That rate is not set by EU as ajs stated.

That rate cannot be set by the UK as you stated.

Exactly.

The EU says that certain things shall be exempt, so no VAT may be charged at all.

The EU says that the standard rate must be a minimum of 15%. So yes, a member country may decide to charge 15%, or 16%, or 21%. But it may not set a rate of 14%, or 10%. And that's for now - In time the EU wants a completely "harmonized" system everywhere.

The EU permits reduced rates for certain things, but then complains about certain member countries making use of that reduced rate, and especially about the U.K. & Ireland's long-term use of zero-rated items (food, books etc.) which it says is "unfair."

Is this what anyone calls a nation being free to set its own rates?

 

[ajstoneservices]

That rate cannot be set by the UK as you stated.

It is set at a specific point and varied up or down within limits, by individual countries. Contrary to your assertion that EU dictates the rate. It does not. It sets the range!

HaHa. I'm off to watch paint dry (seriously, my wife is painting something) far better than banging my head against a wall.

 

[Himaginn]

That rate is not set by EU as ajs stated.

That rate cannot be set by the UK as you stated.

Exactly.

The EU says that certain things shall be exempt, so no VAT may be charged at all.

The EU says that the standard rate must be a minimum of 15%. So yes, a member country may decide to charge 15%, or 16%, or 21%. But it may not set a rate of 14%, or 10%. And that's for now - In time the EU wants a completely "harmonized" system everywhere.

Utter baloney! Your view, and a highly personalised view of EU

The EU permits reduced rates for certain things, but then complains about certain member countries making use of that reduced rate, and especially about the U.K. & Irelands's long-term use of zero-rated items (food, books etc.) which it says is "unfair."

Examples please?

Is this what anyone calls a nation being free to set its own rates?

This is a comment riding and totally dependent on your previous assertion, of which I've yet to see any examples.

 

[PBC_1966]

Like what?

Like all the things listed as exempt here:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/rates-of-vat-on-different-goods-and-services

And what is the implications of this?

That the U.K. is not permitted to charge any VAT on these items.

 

[PBC_1966]

HaHa. I'm off to watch paint dry (seriously, my wife is painting something) far better than banging my head against a wall.

I'm off too - It's a beautful sunny day and I need to get some work done before lunch!

 

[Deleted member 63160]

where I'm located in Shasta County

Awesome mate. You must of heard about "Shastasheen"

 

[Himaginn]

Like what?

Like all the things listed as exempt here:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/rates-of-vat-on-different-goods-and-services

No! That's a UK list of goods and services that ARE subject to VAT.
Some are exempt, some are 0% rated. Some are variously rated. It's a UK list, not a EU list!

And what is the implications of this?

That the U.K. is not permitted to charge any VAT on these items.

That's because it's a UK list!