What is the definition of fixed wiring or an appliance

[Wontdothatagain]

From the HSE, guidance on inspection and testing of electrical equipment

hand-held items, such as hairdryers, that do not have a plug but have been wired in (or fixed) are still considered to be portable appliances, but large electrical items, such as water boilers that are wired in, are not portable appliances as they are not designed to be moved and would come under
the scope of fixed installation maintenance;

 

[crystal ball]

A further thought on the clipped flex scenario, if someone clips a flex does it need a MWC as it becomes fixed wiring

That's for others to decide. As I've said, I wouldn't personally dream of considering the flex of a 'portable item' (common sense definition) as being 'fixed wiring', no matter how immovable or hidden/'protected' I'd made it!

There are, of course, situations in which 'clipped flex' will be reasonably regardable as 'fixed wiring' but, IMO, that will never be primarily because it is clipped.

Kind Regards, John

I agree wholeheartedly with the above

 

[securespark]

Yeah, Fixed wiring ends at the accessory & not the appliance. But I agree with John here: if the appliance wiring was fixed in the same manner as fixed wiring (ie clipped, trunked, etc), rather than loose like a regular portable appliance flex, then it would be classed as fixed wiring.

So if a bit of flex was secured by one clip to hold it clear of the floor it becomes part of the fixed wiring?

No, in the same way that fixed wiring can have no restraints at all, but is still classed as fixed wiring.

 

[JohnW2]

From the HSE, guidance on inspection and testing of electrical equipment:

hand-held items, such as hairdryers, that do not have a plug but have been wired in (or fixed) are still considered to be portable appliances, but large electrical items, such as water boilers that are wired in, are not portable appliances as they are not designed to be moved and would come under the scope of fixed installation maintenance;

That sounds much like I was suggesting, doesn't it - i.e. your cooker hood (and it's wiring) would, using the same sort of rules, probably 'come under the scope of fixed installation maintenance', wouldn't it?

Kind Regards, John

 

[crystal ball]

Yeah, Fixed wiring ends at the accessory & not the appliance. But I agree with John here: if the appliance wiring was fixed in the same manner as fixed wiring (ie clipped, trunked, etc), rather than loose like a regular portable appliance flex, then it would be classed as fixed wiring.

So if a bit of flex was secured by one clip to hold it clear of the floor it becomes part of the fixed wiring?

No, in the same way that fixed wiring can have no restraints at all, but is still classed as fixed wiring.

So at what point does the clipped flex become fixed wiring?

 

[EFLImpudence]

When it is 'fixed'.

 

[Wontdothatagain]

I probably used a bad example and would concede. Lets go for a washing machine wired into a switched fused or a good example would be a hand drier as we have a contract with several McDonalds and they insist that they are tested every 6 months as they are Class1

 

[crystal ball]

When it is 'fixed'.

So if it is fixed by one solitary clip is it fixed?

 

[JohnW2]

So at what point does the clipped flex become fixed wiring?

When it is 'fixed'.

As I've said, at least in terms of deciding whether something comes within the scope of BS7671, Building Regs or otherregs, I personally doubt that whether or not the wiring is literally 'fixed' comes highly (if at all) up the lsit of criteria. As has been suggested, by implication, there are countless examples of wiring which virually all of us would agree was part of the 'fixed wiring of an installation' despite the fact that it was 'fixed' to nothing - lying under floors, draped across a roofspace or 'dangling' within walls.

Maybe 'permanent' would capture the spirit of what was intended somewhat better than 'fixed'?

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

I probably used a bad example and would concede. Lets go for a washing machine wired into a switched fused ...

We've often discussed things like hard-wired washing machines, free-standing ovens etc. etc. in the past, and I think it fair to say that there was not a consensus view. Indeed, there has even been discussion about these 'heavy but not fixed' items when fitted with a 13A plug - some people arguing that since they are too heavy to be 'portable', they form part of the 'fixed installation', even though powered through a plug/socket.

.... or a good example would be a hand drier as we have a contract with several McDonalds and they insist that they are tested every 6 months as they are Class1

I would have thought that, if only by appplication of common sense, many/most people would regard something that was 'screwed to the wall' and hard-wired as being part of the ('fixed'?) 'electrical installation', wouldn't they?

However, isn't there some confusion in this discussion between 'wiring' and 'equipment'? I've been essentially talking about whether or not the wiring is 'fixed', but you now seem to be talking about whether the equipment is 'fixed' or 'portable', in the ciontext of (equipment) testing requirements.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Are you saying that if i had a cooker hood connected to a SFS, the cooker hood would become part of the fixed wiring?

Ask yourself whether you would fix the cooker hood to the wall, or just prop it up on some bricks or pieces of wood.

You might then have the answer to your own question.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

In a commercial property, the same cooker hood would come under the "In service inspection and testing of electrical equipment" not an EICR so in my eyes it is not part of the electrical installation but an appliance.

In a commercial property, would the cooker hood be FIXED to the wall, or just propped up on some bricks or pieces of wood?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

So if a bit of flex was secured by one clip to hold it clear of the floor it becomes part of the fixed wiring?

Yes.

 

[crystal ball]

In a commercial property, the same cooker hood would come under the "In service inspection and testing of electrical equipment" not an EICR so in my eyes it is not part of the electrical installation but an appliance.

Surely that applies to a domestic property too

 

[ban-all-sheds]

That is not my view - I was merely reporting what some people say/think. In my house, there are plenty of examples of flexible power cables to items of equipment being 'clipped' or enclosed in something for tidiness etc., but I wouldn't dream of regarding that as 'fixed wiring'!

This is a bit like you with the word "support".

Do you have problems understanding the meaning of many everyday words?