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I have replaced a Ravenheat fitted by Warmcont, 3 years old, 10 leaks and a blown PCB.
flue runs down wards??
- Thread starter newbuildinstaller
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Woah there Neady!!! yes Im gas safe regd. I keep meaning to contact the gas chamber bit. Iv just been out of my time 2years (hence new gas installer). I didnt start fitting boilers till my second year of my apprenticship, therefore iv only ever fitted condensing boilers. I merely asked a question out of interest as thats what was in the clients property. I was pricing to fit a condensing boiler so I was never going to run the flue downwards. Is it just me but does Agile just pop up everywhere to be smug?! Im sorry I didnt know the answer about flue directions hence why I asked the ~@?!ing question. Thanks to everyone that posted the answer to my question
My Myson Apollo 15/30B is now 22 years old. In that time It has cost me approx £30 on 2 parts, a thermo couple and a pump overrun stat. I guess if I was a layman I would have been persuaded to get rid of it 12 years ago and get a modern combi/condenser
This would have cost me (ball park) £2000. Iwould have saved approx £150 a year on gas. Which means a payback on investment of over 13 years. However before that event, I probably would have had to renew again.and this after spending mega £££s on repairs. You know "sorry mate its the PCB that'l be £300 please".
As for the ecology I have yet to see the carbon footprint for the manufacture, transportation and installation of these new boilers. Oh and do'nt forget the extra electricity they use to be marginaly more efficient at burning gas.
Im keeping my Apollo till I have to shoot it.
Things are not made to be used, they are made for profit.
This would have cost me (ball park) £2000. Iwould have saved approx £150 a year on gas. Which means a payback on investment of over 13 years. However before that event, I probably would have had to renew again.and this after spending mega £££s on repairs. You know "sorry mate its the PCB that'l be £300 please".
As for the ecology I have yet to see the carbon footprint for the manufacture, transportation and installation of these new boilers. Oh and do'nt forget the extra electricity they use to be marginaly more efficient at burning gas.
Im keeping my Apollo till I have to shoot it.
Things are not made to be used, they are made for profit.
As this thread has come alive again, pity it’s concealed in the flue subject matter though, I have a few more comments.
I put a new Potterton Netaheat Electronic in my house in around 1982 -3 with an S plan. Bills were high and the house is solid wall, high ceilings, long side wall quite exposed.
I put in first AQ6000 in the country apparently, Honeywell used me as a guinea pig and I was very impressed, they also gave me one which I put into my own system. Bills came down 20% next winter quarter but comfort was immeasurably superior.
Energy management didn’t catch on because it looked complicated (it wasn’t) and at one time after twelve months, little me, a one man band in a small geographic area, had put more AQ6000’s in than British Gas had in the whole country. At least that’s what Honeywell told me and even if it was sales waffle I prefer to believe it.
I took it out the Netaheat around 1985 – 6 as I foolishly have the policy of not putting something into a customer’s house that I hadn’t tried in my own first. (Sold the Netaheat, installed it and as far as I know it’s still going).
In went a Trisave and my bills came down further.
3 -4 years later out goes the Trisave, several breakdowns and eventually the HEX leaks.
In goes a Glow-Worm Energy Saver. 6 - 7 years later out goes the GW. Breakdowns and general unreliability.
1998 in goes a Baxi HE100, stopped last Christmas, easy repair.
The reason I’m writing this is that the fuel I saved through the boiler improvement alone in no way pay for the inconvenience and expense of changing the appliances poor choices though they may have been. I only make good the outer skin of my wall around the flue now as I find it makes it easier to swap the boilers when their time has come.
A BF or decent PF appliance if fitted with weather comp. has comparable long-term economy compared to HE boilers and is infinitely more reliable.
One of gasbanni’s comments about patched brickwork also made me speculate whether more BF jobs were changed because of breakdown/failure or other reasons such as kitchen or house alterations –the latter I’d bet.
Lastly, I find it interesting that the Apollo is held in such high esteem. I always considered them one of the cheapest of contract boilers and took several out on an estate near me. I also say that I would now revise that opinion as the installations on the estate were far from perfect and I now am of the opinion that the Apollo’s and Ideals (non-condensing at least (Turbo included)) were OK and a lot of the trouble and shortened life is due to the installers on a house bashing price schedule with no possibility of any after service call backs.
Like I’ve said elsewhere, the most important thing about a boiler is the man who puts it in.
EDIT: Actually, first reading of this doesn't reflect very well on me as I've had a lot of boilers. I will say I am careful when I put them in.
I put a new Potterton Netaheat Electronic in my house in around 1982 -3 with an S plan. Bills were high and the house is solid wall, high ceilings, long side wall quite exposed.
I put in first AQ6000 in the country apparently, Honeywell used me as a guinea pig and I was very impressed, they also gave me one which I put into my own system. Bills came down 20% next winter quarter but comfort was immeasurably superior.
Energy management didn’t catch on because it looked complicated (it wasn’t) and at one time after twelve months, little me, a one man band in a small geographic area, had put more AQ6000’s in than British Gas had in the whole country. At least that’s what Honeywell told me and even if it was sales waffle I prefer to believe it.
I took it out the Netaheat around 1985 – 6 as I foolishly have the policy of not putting something into a customer’s house that I hadn’t tried in my own first. (Sold the Netaheat, installed it and as far as I know it’s still going).
In went a Trisave and my bills came down further.
3 -4 years later out goes the Trisave, several breakdowns and eventually the HEX leaks.
In goes a Glow-Worm Energy Saver. 6 - 7 years later out goes the GW. Breakdowns and general unreliability.
1998 in goes a Baxi HE100, stopped last Christmas, easy repair.
The reason I’m writing this is that the fuel I saved through the boiler improvement alone in no way pay for the inconvenience and expense of changing the appliances poor choices though they may have been. I only make good the outer skin of my wall around the flue now as I find it makes it easier to swap the boilers when their time has come.
A BF or decent PF appliance if fitted with weather comp. has comparable long-term economy compared to HE boilers and is infinitely more reliable.
One of gasbanni’s comments about patched brickwork also made me speculate whether more BF jobs were changed because of breakdown/failure or other reasons such as kitchen or house alterations –the latter I’d bet.
Lastly, I find it interesting that the Apollo is held in such high esteem. I always considered them one of the cheapest of contract boilers and took several out on an estate near me. I also say that I would now revise that opinion as the installations on the estate were far from perfect and I now am of the opinion that the Apollo’s and Ideals (non-condensing at least (Turbo included)) were OK and a lot of the trouble and shortened life is due to the installers on a house bashing price schedule with no possibility of any after service call backs.
Like I’ve said elsewhere, the most important thing about a boiler is the man who puts it in.
EDIT: Actually, first reading of this doesn't reflect very well on me as I've had a lot of boilers. I will say I am careful when I put them in.
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Improving the efficiency of a boiler has little effect in a small flat or well insulated small house.
When the gas bill is much higher with a larger property then the saving on a £2000 p.a. gas bill becomes about £500 a year. In that case the cost of a replacement boiler can become a fairly short payback.
Tony
When the gas bill is much higher with a larger property then the saving on a £2000 p.a. gas bill becomes about £500 a year. In that case the cost of a replacement boiler can become a fairly short payback.
Tony
i've a Wimpey built (22 years old) timber frame 4 bed detached, with excellent insulation in the loft and walls
Gas appliances are :- Apollo 15/30b - 4 ring hob and an excellent Burley flueless gas fire. Gas charges last year £380
Gas appliances are :- Apollo 15/30b - 4 ring hob and an excellent Burley flueless gas fire. Gas charges last year £380
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