Is it a defining moment?

[skitzee2k]

So "crap" means policies that are widely agreed rather than ones which do not have wide support?

No, they are not widely agreed.

For example, we are getting voting reform...even though Tories and Labour were both for the FPTP system...meaning a combined 19.5 million votes were for parties that want to stay as we are, and less than 7 million wanted voting reform.....now we might be getting voting reform...

We will probably be getting a Cap on immigration which only 10.6 million wanted and 16.5 didn't.

It will not be what most people want, it will be what the politians want.

 

[Infidel]

.but the voters didn't vote for the party only to see their policies mutilated...and in no way will this be proportional. The Libs will punch FAR beyond their weight as they have nothing to lose. They have more power now than they have ever had and they LOST 6 seats!!

Yes and thats the irony that both the major parties are stuck with thanks to first past the post, delicious days ahead for the arse lickers.

 

[Lincsbodger]

on the other hand, the sight of the slimy lying toad Mandelson wriggling, helpless, as other people take the reigns of power, and he's out out out, is very gratifying.

a nasty, unpleasant little turd.

 

[skitzee2k]

.but the voters didn't vote for the party only to see their policies mutilated...and in no way will this be proportional. The Libs will punch FAR beyond their weight as they have nothing to lose. They have more power now than they have ever had and they LOST 6 seats!!

Yes and thats the irony that both the major parties are stuck with thanks to first past the post, delicious days ahead for the a**e lickers.

Infidel...you are pointing at this current situation as a failure of FPTP....if this situation is so bad, why are you in favour of PR which will make this thing happen EVERY ELECTION when FPTP has only delivered this ...what, twice for a few months??

HUGE flaw in your reasoning somewhere.

 

[Lincsbodger]

happen EVERY ELECTION when FPTP has only delivered this ...what, twice for a few months??

you mean five times in 120 years...............for a total of 7 years.

 

[skitzee2k]

happen EVERY ELECTION when FPTP has only delivered this ...what, twice for a few months??

you mean five times in 120 years...............for a total of 7 years.

Really? You including the war coalitions in there?

 

[skitzee2k]

happen EVERY ELECTION when FPTP has only delivered this ...what, twice for a few months??

you mean five times in 120 years...............for a total of 7 years.

I make it
1) 1885 (lasted to 86)
2) 1929 (lasted to 31)
3) 1974 (lasted 8 months)
4) 2010

So 54 election since 1800 have resulted in 4 hung parliaments...totalling 3.5 years....NOT a good record. I was off on my twice...


edit

Just so everyone can digest this, that is FOUR governments with less than a usual term between them. That is VERY unstable and this coalition type of government is what you would get from PR EVERY time...not just 4/54 times.

 

[Infidel]

HUGE flaw in your reasoning somewhere.

I think you mean voting system, when was the last time a government actually achieved an overall majority of votes cast per head of population that bothered to vote. I cant be arsed to look it up but lets say the winner got 37% that leaves 63% of the people not voting for the government, how is that democratic.

 

[skitzee2k]

HUGE flaw in your reasoning somewhere.

I think you mean voting system, when was the last time a government actually achieved an overall majority of votes cast per head of population that bothered to vote. I cant be a***d to look it up but lets say the winner got 37% that leaves 63% of the people not voting for the government, how is that democratic.

Look, it is simple.

There are 650 seats. Each seat is voted on by the people that seat answers to.
The seat is awarded to the person with the most votes in that area.

You need majority governments to rule effectively and honestly and you need seats to ensure accountability.

 

[Lincsbodger]

happen EVERY ELECTION when FPTP has only delivered this ...what, twice for a few months??

you mean five times in 120 years...............for a total of 7 years.

I make it
1) 1885 (lasted to 86)
2) 1929 (lasted to 31)
3) 1974 (lasted 8 months)
4) 2010

So 54 election since 1800 have resulted in 4 hung parliaments...totalling 3.5 years....NOT a good record. I was off on my twice...

you forget

1997: John Major - he lost his wafer thin majority and had a minority government for the last 6 moths of his government

1978 - James Callaghan (The Winter of Discontent)

1910: - Herbert Asquith. Called a second election, got an identical result, ruled for 43 months as a minority government.

1923: - Stanley Baldwin. Stepped aside for Ramsey MacDonald. Baldwin's tactics were rewarded when they were returned to power in a landslide victory less than a year later in 1924.

 

[Gasman28]

You need majority governments to rule effectively and honestly and you need seats to ensure accountability.

That has to be an Oxy Moron surely?
I'd like to meet an honest politician. It appears over the years, that it doesn't matter who you vote for - they are all tarred with the same brush.They all sleep in Banana shaped beds, cos none of them can sleep straight at night.

 

[skitzee2k]

happen EVERY ELECTION when FPTP has only delivered this ...what, twice for a few months??

you mean five times in 120 years...............for a total of 7 years.

I make it
1) 1885 (lasted to 86)
2) 1929 (lasted to 31)
3) 1974 (lasted 8 months)
4) 2010

So 54 election since 1800 have resulted in 4 hung parliaments...totalling 3.5 years....NOT a good record. I was off on my twice...

you forget

1997: John Major - he lost his wafer thin majority and had a minority government for the last 6 moths of his government

1978 - James Callaghan (The Winter of Discontent)

1910: - Herbert Asquith. Called a second election, got an identical result, ruled for 43 months as a minority government.

1923: - Stanley Baldwin. Stepped aside for Ramsey MacDonald. Baldwin's tactics were rewarded when they were returned to power in a landslide victory less than a year later in 1924.

Two of these resulted from by elections and defections though rather than General elections using FPTP which we are discussing here...i think i have to give you the 1923 +1910...these added another year and a bit between them...so we are up to ....6 hung parliaments from general election...totally 5 year...

As I have said, that is VERY bad for the country and stability. PR would make this happen all the time.

 

[skitzee2k]

You need majority governments to rule effectively and honestly and you need seats to ensure accountability.

That has to be an Oxy Moron surely?
I'd like to meet an honest politician. It appears over the years, that it doesn't matter who you vote for - they are all tarred with the same brush.They all sleep in Banana shaped beds, cos none of them can sleep straight at night.

How many politicians have you got to know personally?

 

[Lincsbodger]

.6 hung parliaments from general election...totally 5 year...

As I have said, that is VERY bad for the country and stability. PR would make this happen all the time.

Oh yes, and you havent seen the worst yet.

we have a triple AAA credit rating because we normally have stable strong majority governments. If Cameron and Clegg dont do some expeditious finger extraction, the markets will start to panic, sterling will bomb, share will evaporate, they will pull our credit rating and hen we are third world for 50 years.

The last time we had a minority government, shares dropped 40% in 6 months. the markets and the pound have already started to take a hammering.

 

[Gasman28]

How many politicians have you got to know personally?

How is that relevant? Possibly, about the same number that you know?
Has your local MP had his/her moat cleaned?
Have they claimed for anything that they shouldn't have?
I'd love a job as an MP- cheap booze in their bars, lots of underhand( alllegedly) expenses, and as much bullsh*t that you can take.