Last chance….

[JonathanM]

I won’t keep banging on about “If we had PR, Reform would have X number of seats in parliament”.

I think Nigel will, though.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Maybe so but I’ll accept the result unlike the sour faced whiney remain voters. I won’t keep banging on about “If we had PR, Reform would have X number of seats in parliament”.

You really don't understand.

X million votes might go to reform and result in very few seats (or maybe a lot of seats)

High % support and no seats is not a fair representation of the voting public.

Regardless of the outcome, the public should be represented as they vote.

 

[kingandy2nd]

This girl has a lovely voice:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1808714894583185621

 

[ajohn]

LOL I wish people would get a grip with the problems with various forms of PR. Like FPTP they have their own set of problems.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

LOL I wish people would get a grip with the problems with various forms of PR. Like FPTP they have their own set of problems.

Yes they do.

But they at least represent the people. And people vote for who they want. Not just against those they don't.

Coalitions, usually the result of voting like that actually work.

 

[charliegolf]

Quite a few saying if Reform get a few seats (maybe even just one?) with millions of votes, Farage will commence an electoral reform campaign.

Which will be ignored.

 

[charliegolf]

12.6% and just under 4 million votes.

Noted, I took the percentage as millions of votes. The memory. My point holds though- they didn't get 12% of the seats.

 

[ajohn]

Japan?

As of March 2023, the Japanese public debt is estimated to be approximately 9.2 trillion US dollars (1.30 quadrillion yen), or 263% of GDP, and is the highest of any developed nation. 43.3% of this debt is held by the Bank of Japan.

Japan in terms of economy is nothing remotely like the UK. Of late it seems they are glad to see some deflation at last. In the news but not checked.

The IFS think that the UK could push up debt but aren't sure what the markets response would be. Truss gave us an idea but it might relate to what the debt was used for. Japan grew via their banks largely owning companies and supplying money when needed as the returns were high thanks to a huge increase in exports. Then it got overheated. A job in Japan for a long time was also a job for life.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

Labour, or anybody, will be in trouble from day 1.

Because of the mess the Tories have put us in.

Why talk of speculation when there are actual facts

I'm not anticipating a long honeymoon period for them. It might suffice early doors to say 'we're having to sort out the mess we were left with' however I can imagine groans if they're still saying it 24+ months down the line.

Mind you, I think Starmer said they'll need 4ish years for the public to see real improvements coming through.

 

[denso13]

Mind you, I think Starmer said they'll need 4ish years for the public to see real improvements coming through.

Some say Brexit will take 50 years to start showing results but they'll be on here claiming Labour have failed after a week or two.

 

[Brigadier]

As of March 2023, the Japanese public debt is estimated to be approximately 9.2 trillion US dollars (1.30 quadrillion yen), or 263% of GDP, and is the highest of any developed nation. 43.3% of this debt is held by the Bank of Japan.

Japan in terms of economy is nothing remotely like the UK. Of late it seems they are glad to see some deflation at last. In the news but not checked.

The IFS think that the UK could push up debt but aren't sure what the markets response would be. Truss gave us an idea but it might relate to what the debt was used for. Japan grew via their banks largely owning companies and supplying money when needed as the returns were high thanks to a huge increase in exports. Then it got overheated. A job in Japan for a long time was also a job for life.

A lot of words - again - to completely miss the point - again.


You said that high debt levels would not be tolerated by the markets.
Which is clearly incorrect.

 

[diy_fun_uk]

Some say Brexit will take 50 years to start showing results but they'll be on here claiming Labour have failed after a week or two.

lol, no doubt some will. I think looking at it objectively, some of the issues will by their very nature take years to rectify or as I should probably say, attempt to rectify. Then we're into debates about genuine, cross-party, long term strategy to ensure improvements are delivered even if the governing party changes.

 

[ajohn]

Mind you, I think Starmer said they'll need 4ish years for the public to see real improvements coming through.

At least that shows signs of honesty. The early helps they mention - targets.

The current aspect I dislike intently is the Tory Labour smear campaign. Many are at it one way or another but the Tory one without finding out is pure smoke. Smoke gets in your eyes and you can't see so well.

 

[denso13]

Smoke gets in your eyes and you can't see so well

 

[Diver Fred]

As of March 2023, the Japanese public debt is estimated to be approximately 9.2 trillion US dollars (1.30 quadrillion yen), or 263% of GDP, and is the highest of any developed nation. 43.3% of this debt is held by the Bank of Japan.

Japan in terms of economy is nothing remotely like the UK. Of late it seems they are glad to see some deflation at last. In the news but not checked.

The IFS think that the UK could push up debt but aren't sure what the markets response would be. Truss gave us an idea but it might relate to what the debt was used for. Japan grew via their banks largely owning companies and supplying money when needed as the returns were high thanks to a huge increase in exports. Then it got overheated. A job in Japan for a long time was also a job for life.

A lot of words - again - to completely miss the point - again.


You said that high debt levels would not be tolerated by the markets.
Which is clearly incorrect.

The one advantage that Japan has over the UK is that the people are proud to buy products mainly made in Japan unlike the UK, when we had a broad manufacturing base we bought foriegn as a part of 'one-upmanship'.
And the money men or the HMG don't like companies that have their hands in many industries - look what happened to GEC under Arnold Weinstock - where is the component businesses now?
British Telecom is a mere shadow of it's former self; again it has shrunk down compared to what it was 30 years ago; Cellnet, now O2, split off at the insistance of the city after Paying more money than could be afforded for 3G spectrum (that hurt Vodaphone as well), Prior to that the merger with MCI killed because of the City money men (who didn't or don't understand USA money men). It's now 2 operating parts EE/BT switching and OpenReach.
BMC/BL - as much the management fault as the workers; the management for not promoting 'continous development' and upgrading of their vehicles and assembly practises, the workers for striking at the slightest change in the 60's and 70's.