More racism

[Bodd]

I

I think these types of thread are quite interesting. I'm hazarding a guess (although happy to stand corrected) that most people participating are white. So the chances are you've never really experienced much racist activity (minor or major) directed towards you. Therefore whilst you can sympathise, it can be asserted you can't really empathise or fully understand how it feels to have actions, comments, looks directed towards you that you interpret as being racist or having racist undertones.

I'm biracial, nearing 50, and thankfully have not experienced a great deal of racism in my life. However I have nevertheless experienced it. To an extent I get fed up with discussions around assertions such as 'it's my right to say what I want and it's up to you as to whether or not I've caused you offence' as often, although not always, these arguments are put forward simply because some people don't want to adjust the way they socially interact.

Maybe going off on a tangent here however let me give you just one very low level example. I remember one time I was standing in a longish queue waiting to pay for fuel. There were maybe 3-4 people in front of me. The woman serving was being very polite, smiley and chirpy with everyone. 'Hello love, just the fuel? There's your change, thanks love' etc etc. Then it was my turn to be served. I noticed a distinct change in her entire demeanor. All that was said to me was along the lines of 'That'll be £20.' I walk away, next person gets served and she immediately reverts to type 'Hello love, just the paper is it? There you go, thanks love.' Now of course there could be any number of reasons for this, I accept that. However as a biracial person with a few decades on the planet, trust me, you get attuned to certain scenarios. Of course it's possible to misinterpret, not saying it's not.

I often use the imaginary scenario of the meeting room before I open my gob. Example. Imagine you're in a meeting with x people. In the room there's someone that looks as though they possibly originate from Pakistan. You're asked 'what's the problem with the order we've placed?' You know the answer is the supplier, based in Pakistan, has failed to deliver when promised. Now, outside the meeting room, let's say your normal response would be 'it's those blo0dy Pa*i's again!' However in your meeting, there's someone possibly from Pakistan sitting opposite you. Would you go ahead and say 'it's those blo0dy Pa*i's again' or might you choose a different way to answer the question? If the latter, in my mind this means you know the response isn't socially acceptable, so why use it? I just apply this in all scenarios.

I also think about the knock-on consequences of my actions. My mum is white Scottish, my dad was Indian. Mum had numerous situations in work/social settings (dad not there) when people would be talking about 'Pa*i's' (cause you know, one term covers them all) seemingly forgetting she was married to someone of that origin! To this day she recalls how much that hurt her. You might have lived your life thinking it's harmless to poke fun at disabled people whether they overhear you or not. Can you hand on heart say you'd still be of that opinion if you had a disabled child and you overheard a group of people making fun of them e.g. when sitting in a restaurant? Still harmless fun? You might even go over and join in with them, yeah?

I think it's pretty simple. If you conclude your actions might offend, try to take a different approach.

Had this experience yesterday... I'm chatty with all the nurses. Very interested where they are from and how they like England.
I'm genuinely interested. A polish assistant yesterday come in really chatty. I engaged in conversation but I was not really in the mood. She's telling me about her Hungarian friend this and that.
"You don't like" she said...
No I was just not in the mood for a chatty conversation. .

Sometimes I think I'm over nice (not false) but I like to put a smile on someone's face and I want them to know im interested in their culture.

Looking for a space in a very packed car park; A car pulled out, for me to get this space i has to drive over a kerb... As soon as I did this I see a Muslim lady the other side waiting for that space. She smiled and drove off... I got out and run to try and find her, so I could give her the space.. I felt rotten even more so because I felt what how she may have felt.

 

[Bodd]

I

 

[Dangee]

Nosey. This is a forum for the most part made up of tradesmen & women. Not an English exam. Weirdo

 

[EFLImpudence]

Don't call Bodd a weirdo.

 

[SirGalahad]

In what way?

If you argue that P aki cannot be racist as Pakistani isn't a race then you say if someone thinks you look like a Pakistani - how can that stand because you are ascribing physical characteristics.

If you describe somebody looks like a Pakistan / Indian then you are defining it as physical charateristics.

If I said describe a muslim and the first picture that came to your mind was a brown person with a beard - why is that. Or if I said describe an Englishman it's a white person with light coloured hair.

 

[EFLImpudence]

If you argue that P aki cannot be racist as Pakistani isn't a race then you say if someone thinks you look like a Pakistani - how can that stand because you are ascribing physical characteristics.
If you describe somebody looks like a Pakistan / Indian then you are defining it as physical charateristics.

Is that relevant?

Why then is Diy telling us of his experience?

If I said describe a muslim and the first picture that came to your mind was a brown person with a beard - why is that. Or if I said describe an Englishman it's a white person with light coloured hair.

Have you been talking to IT or Bobby?

 

[Bodd]

Your views on race are so outdated you don't agree women can run Marathons.

EfL has a very balanced view on this subject

 

[Bodd]

That could be you jumping to conclusions

Id say that she was pretty obvious,

Edit: Then again Ive read other possible reasons

 

[SirGalahad]

Is that relevant?

Why then is Diy telling us of his experience?


Have you been talking to IT or Bobby?

It is and it's why you have gone off at a tangent.

That was DIY own personal recollection and understanding of the event. Without ever talking to that woman we cannot determine whether it was or wasn't racist. So the lack of evidence means we cannot determine it either way.

 

[Bodd]

Are Pakistani/Indian one of the most racist to each other?

YES

 

[Bodd]

There's racism, as in dislike of another nationality, culture, etc.
Then there's racism as in a structural inequality. There's a difference.
If you need it explaining, I'm happy to do so.

Edit
And festive almost realises it:

Would you explain to me please

 

[Bodd]

I'm still waiting to find out who the Muslim was in my post?

#confused

Some people look at anyone with brown skin and think that they are Muslim...... I think maybe EFL's point

 

[festive]

Someone on here recently referred to A Scotsman as a Scotchman, ffs. I would put that ignorance up there with could of instead of could have.

Ah here we have the pallbearer for the educated

What you waffling on about tonight? Scot you mean a sweaty sock?

 

[Mottie]

does not alter the fact that it is the name of the country of Pakistan meaning Pakiland like Scotland

There's no such place. It's called Pakistan. Your use of such a made-up name for Pakistan, to any Pakistani, wold be considered highly offensive.

Why are there so many Stan countries?
There are seven countries in Central Asia with the suffix "-stan": Kazakhstan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, Afghanistan, and Pakistan. The suffix comes from the Persian root istan, or "land"—hence the "land of the Uzbeks," "land of the Kazakhs," and so forth.

 

[Bodd]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/19/home-office-report-grooming-gangs-not-muslim


Yeah, nope.

I don't think anyone thinks there are not white grooming gangs.... The difference with the Muslim grooming gangs is that their victims are generally not from their cultures or back ground.


White British groomers find each other from all over the place because they have the same sick interest in young girls.

Muslim groomers abuse their victims with their Uncles, Dad, Brothers, cousins, and friends.
Do you not think thats an ingrained problem?