The real problem with the EU is whose in control.

[Himaginn]

I prefer to be brief and to the point. For all your bluster the DIYnot poll is a landslide for OUT

I've edited your comment for you to make it more accurate. NB, I've stated that I've edited your comment, not done so sneakily and pretended I hadn't. Additionally, I've made your comment more accurate, not changed the context, concept or semantics.
The DIYnot poll is bolstered by your multiple personality, no doubt.
But this poll has no bearing on the result or a proper nationwide poll.

I recognise your brevity, and your insincerity.

Some of my posts are sincere, some are just poking fun at you and your little band... Truth is, it just doesn't matter there is nothing you can do and I don't care

So you admit again that some of your comments are intentionally dishonest.
It's so difficult to decide which is which no-one bothers anymore.

 

[Himaginn]

EDIT: Sorry, messed up the quoting will sort it when I get home tonight.

Sorry, you post is in such a mess, I can't follow it.
No wonder you get confused with simple edits.

 

[Fire and Ice]

Rubbish. Greece's woes are to do with the historical way they entered EU and the lack of governance over collection of taxes, and the refusal for government to evolve into a satisfactory way of governing.

But the EU approved Greece's entry to the EU, did they not think to check their books or did they just not care, suggesting that the EU broke its own rules...Perhaps they will break the rules over the entry of Turkey too.

To change the way that Greece runs its country and collect its taxes, then it would require the installation of an EU controlled government and the conversion of Greeks into Germans...Oh! seems the assimilation process is under way.

How about discussing UK Brexit, not Greece. Or do you just want to derail the discussion?

But Greece is in the EU, it is in the Eurozone and so Greece is relevant to this topic... Discussing how the EU has crushed poor Greece after it accepted it into the EU knowing that the books were cooked seems to make you want to change the subject... Why is that?

 

[Fire and Ice]

So you admit again that some of your comments are intentionally dishonest.
It's so difficult to decide which is which no-one bothers anymore.

The folk on here know that I love to crank your handle and when they read my posts, know when I am being truthful... They know that when they read your posts, that you are a fraud..

 

[peterchichester]

the UK will have to be fully integrated into the EU and will have to adopt the Euro

Complete *******s.

I don't understand the fuss about having laws made by people we didn't elect. I live in West Sussex and so have always had Conservative MP's, I have never voted Conservative. Even if I had, MP's just vote for their party when they are told to (unless there is a referendum!). Decisions are made by the cabinet, none of whom can I vote for. I imagine tax decisions are made by Osborne plus a bunch of civil servants who nobody has voted for and then automatically passed by obedient mp's. On that basis it doesn't matter to me who makes the laws.

 

[PBC_1966]

When they can dictate how our vat system is run and the rate at which it is applied (as they will soon be doing with our tax system)

Pure fiction. Tax rates are decided by individual members. Look it up before making silly statements. Oops silly me, that's not how the Out-ers present their case.

But as you yourself noted earlier on (or perhaps in one of the other EU threads, I forget now!), the EU stipulates that the standard VAT rate must be a minimum of 15%. It also stipulates what goods and services must be exempt from VAT. So member countries are "free" to set their own tax rates only within the bounds set by the EU. And that is just the situation at present; the ultimate aim is the "harmonization" of VAT rates throughout the EU.

When they can tells us who to trade with and at what price.

You are being utterly stupid now. They do not set prices of our goods.

But you concede that the EU does tell the U.K. with whom it may trade and under what conditions, in terms of import duty charged, whether VAT has to be applied, and so on?

When they say we can't stop known criminals entering our country and murdering, raping and robbing people here (We had another EE on EE murder in our town last week. And a lady raped by two of them)

Oh here we go again. Indigenous people do not commit crimes

Of course they do, but does that change the fact that the EU can dictate who must be allowed into the United Kingdom? Just because some Brits, born and bred, might be nasty pieces of work, that doesn't mean that the country should be forced to allow foreign criminals in as well.

 

[PBC_1966]

The U.K. only adopted the over-complicated VAT system in the first place as a condition of joining what was then the EEC.

This is your interpretation of why it was adopted.
It obviously overlooks the reasons why all the other non-EU countries adopted the VAT system.
So not an argument based on rationale.

It's an argument based upon a matter of historical record. Whatever reasons other countries outside of the EEC/EU might have had for adopting a VAT-like system doesn't change the fact that as far as the U.K. is concerned it was forced to adopt VAT as a condition of joining the EEC.

No doubt we could trawl through the legislative site and find something, but perhaps this quote from the Association of Chartered Certified Accountants will satisfy you:

For many people in the UK VAT has always been a part of their lives, but in fact it has been in use in the country for (only) 40 years. The adoption of VAT had been a requirement for membership of the European Economic Community. Hence, on 1 April 1973 the previously levied Purchase Tax was replaced by Value Added Tax (VAT).

http://www.accaglobal.com/content/dam/acca/global/PDF-technical/tax-publications/tech-tp-vat40.pdf

 

[ajstoneservices]

EDIT: Sorry, messed up the quoting will sort it when I get home tonight.

Sorry, you post is in such a mess, I can't follow it.
No wonder you get confused with simple edits.

It is dick-head that's why I said I would sort it tonight.

 

[JohnD]

The U.K. only adopted the over-complicated VAT system in the first place as a condition of joining what was then the EEC.

What makes you add the word "only?"

 

[PBC_1966]

What makes you add the word "only?"

Because that's why the U.K. adopted it.

 

[Fire and Ice]

the UK will have to be fully integrated into the EU and will have to adopt the Euro

Complete *******s.

I don't understand the fuss about having laws made by people we didn't elect. I live in West Sussex and so have always had Conservative MP's, I have never voted Conservative. Even if I had, MP's just vote for their party when they are told to (unless there is a referendum!). Decisions are made by the cabinet, none of whom can I vote for. I imagine tax decisions are made by Osborne plus a bunch of civil servants who nobody has voted for and then automatically passed by obedient mp's. On that basis it doesn't matter to me who makes the laws.

So you think that the EU will allow the UK to remain as it is? Are you really that naive?

Since you are happy to be dictated to by unelected officials, I understand that North Korea is suitably miserable this time of year

 

[PBC_1966]

The fundamental aim of the EU is that "ever closer union" which is in the treaty. It will just keep on pushing for more and more things to be "harmonized" over time, for the ultimate aim is an EU in which every member nation uses the same currency, has exactly the same tax structure and rates, the same employment legislation, the same regulations for motor vehicles, the exact same laws for.... Well, you name it, that's what it wants to achieve - A federal European superstate in which everything imaginable is centrally controlled.

 

[jockscott]

that's what it wants to achieve - A federal European superstate in which everything imaginable is centrally controlled.

Which brings us back very nicely to the original question "The real problem with the EU is , "Who is in control???" Certainly not the UK,, My personal bet is on Germany

 

[ladylola]

I don't understand the fuss about having laws made by people we didn't elect. I live in West Sussex and so have always had Conservative MP's, I have never voted Conservative. Even if I had, MP's just vote for their party when they are told to (unless there is a referendum!). Decisions are made by the cabinet, none of whom can I vote for. I imagine tax decisions are made by Osborne plus a bunch of civil servants who nobody has voted for and then automatically passed by obedient mp's. On that basis it doesn't matter to me who makes the laws.

Yes I agree. There's a lot of talk about the representatives of the EU not being voted for by us ( except for British MEPs obviously) but it's exactly the same situation in regards to our own parliament . We can vote for one person but can't vote for the other 649 ! So is there any real difference having laws from Brussels forced upon us than having laws forced upon us from Westminster ? The out campaign has made a lot out of the notion of us making our own laws and running our own country but they could do so much more . We need something better than stopping in and having BAU or leaving and having BAU .

 

[Himaginn]

EDIT: Sorry, messed up the quoting will sort it when I get home tonight.

Sorry, you post is in such a mess, I can't follow it.
No wonder you get confused with simple edits.

It is dick-head that's why I said I would sort it tonight.

Where is it? I was looking forward to reading your responses.