Unwell Fluke 1652

[stillp]

One side of the ('split') L lead socket, goes through the coil of a little toroidal transformer and thence through a fuse (** see below). If one removes that fuse, on power-up one gets an "Err1" message ("failed self-test - return to manufacturer"), rather than the "LEAd" message.

That doesn't seem logical. If there's no current flow through the fuse, how can the circuit know if it's there or not? There must be another connection somewhere.

 

[JohnW2]

That doesn't seem logical. If there's no current flow through the fuse, how can the circuit know if it's there or not? There must be another connection somewhere.

Presumably there must be some current flow through the fuse when it is present (as you say, via some 'other connection' {other than via the test lead} - I've never suggested that I have found 'all connections'!) - so the absence of that current when the fuse is removed is presumably sensed and leads to the "Err1" message.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Ah, it's actually more complicated than I previously described.

If a lead is plugged into the L socket, the "LEAd" message appears on power-up, regardless of whether or not the 'internal' fuse is in place.

If no lead is plugged into the L socket, with the internal fuse in place, one again gets the "LEAd" message. However if (with no lead plugged in) one removes the internal fuse, one gets the "Err1" message. It takes about 1 second for that message to appear, and when it does appear there is an audible click of a relay operating. There is no such click when the internal fuse is present, whether or not a lead is plugged in (i.e. when I get the "LEAd" message).

Goodness knows how to interpret any of that!

Kind Regards, John

 

[Iggifer]

Well that sucks. Could try one of the 'no obligation quotes' people, but means you at least have to cover two lots of postage if you don't like their price.

I know this doesn't help in anyway, but I had a similar problem with my Megger 1552 recently, the Live probe was just not doing anything.

Took it apart and for some reason, there's a lead soldered from the PCB to the L probe, which in turn has two extra cables soldered to it, that. go off to the 3-Pin probe port and the switched probe port. The whole lot had worked their way free from the solder.

Couldn't seem to find any spare parts online so just soldered a little lead onto the probe connection and put all of the other leads into a Wago for now

Shame the Fluke isn't as simple as the 1552 (don't get me wrong, there's plenty of different PCBs in there, but what they can keep simple, they have kept simple. Whether or not that's the case with the current range, I doubt.

 

[JohnW2]

Well that sucks. Could try one of the 'no obligation quotes' people, but means you at least have to cover two lots of postage if you don't like their price.

Yes, that would be one approach, although I suspect that commercial repair of any sort would not work out as cost-effective.

Took it apart and for some reason, there's a lead soldered from the PCB to the L probe, which in turn has two extra cables soldered to it, that. go off to the 3-Pin probe port and the switched probe port. The whole lot had worked their way free from the solder. ... Couldn't seem to find any spare parts online so just soldered a little lead onto the probe connection and put all of the other leads into a Wago for now

I'm pleased for you! When I took mine apart, it was obviously in the hope that I would find something as 'obvious and simple' as that. As things are, I haven't, and it does look to me that the fault is probably not one I'm going to be able to address myself!

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

I am puzzled by the fact that the machine does not have this 'lead' missing function for the neutral lead.
Would there be any reason for this?

Can you see any difference between the N circuit and L & PE circuit?

I suppose it is made more difficult by you not knowing whether the fault is related to L or PE.
Does it do anything when you pull out the non-faulty one?

I know you don't know which it is but with both leads in does it do anything when you pull out one which may give an indication of which is faulty.

 

[Lectrician]

Thanks. At that price, it might be worth considering, since I'm unlikely to get a replacement for that figure (used 1652s seem to be going for £180-£200 on eBay).

However, there are a good few places out there offering (often 'fixed price') repairs of these machines, and a couple I've seen are quoting 'fixed prices' of around £180, coupled with boasts that this is a lot less than Fluke would charge. I therefore wonder how long ago you got the problem fixed by Fluke for £110?

Kind Regards, John

Probably 18 months ago. Sent back through my wholesaler.

 

[JohnW2]

I am puzzled by the fact that the machine does not have this 'lead' missing function for the neutral lead. Would there be any reason for this?

Indeed. Even if one thinks in terms of Bernard's 'testing for dead' reason for having 'unplugged leads detection', the N is surely just as important as the L (if one is measuring L-N voltage).

Can you see any difference between the N circuit and L & PE circuit?

Yes, at a superficial level. The lack of 'lead detection' on N is clearly intentional since, although the N-lead socket is 'split', just like the other two, there is a fat PCB track joining its two halves.

I suppose it is made more difficult by you not knowing whether the fault is related to L or PE. Does it do anything when you pull out the non-faulty one? I know you don't know which it is but with both leads in does it do anything when you pull out one which may give an indication of which is faulty.

Not directly, but you've given me an idea ... hang on for a moment ....

... Aha!! With the internal fuse in place (i.e. the 'normal' situation), there is no difference - I get the "LEAd" message regardless of whether both L and PE are plugged in, both are not plugged in, or one is plugged in and the other not.

HOWEVER, with the 'internal fuse' removed, there is a difference ... As per my penultimate post, if I remove the 'internal fuse', then when I switch the machine on without leads plugged in, I get an "Err1" (and a relay click) instead of the "LEAd" message. However, I now find that this ('Err1' message and click) only happens when the L lead (with or without others) is unplugged. In other words, if the L lead is plugged in and the internal fuse removed, I then get the "LEAd" message (not the "Err1" one), regardless of whether the PE lead is plugged in or not.

Hence there is clearly a difference in behaviour of the L and PE (albeit only when the internal fuse is removed) - but I'm not quite sure what it means in terms of which is 'faulty'!

Kind Regards, John

 

[jj4091]

Does it make any difference if you short the leads together & then switch on?

 

[JohnW2]

Does it make any difference if you short the leads together & then switch on?

Thanks for your interest.

No. I've just tried all possible combinations of shorting the leads (and then switching on) and none make any difference.

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

... Aha!! With the internal fuse in place (i.e. the 'normal' situation), there is no difference - I get the "LEAd" message regardless of whether both L and PE are plugged in, both are not plugged in, or one is plugged in and the other not.

Because it thinks there is a lead missing whatever you do. Inconclusive.

HOWEVER, with the 'internal fuse' removed, there is a difference ... As per my penultimate post, if I remove the 'internal fuse', then when I switch the machine on without leads plugged in, I get an "Err1" (and a relay click) instead of the "LEAd" message. However, I now find that this ('Err1' message and click) only happens when the L lead (with or without others) is unplugged. In other words, if the L lead is plugged in and the internal fuse removed, I then get the "LEAd" message (not the "Err1" one), regardless of whether the PE lead is plugged in or not.

Confusing - but

would that indicate it is the PE that is faulty because the L position makes a difference?

 

[JohnW2]

Because it thinks there is a lead missing whatever you do. Inconclusive.

Exactly.

Confusing - but .... would that indicate it is the PE that is faulty because the L position makes a difference?

As I said, I really don't know. One might look at it the way you suggest. Conversely, one could say that the fact that (with internal fuse removed) doing things to the L alters whether or not an error state arises ("Err1") perhaps suggests that there is a fault associated with the L.

I suppose it largely depends upon what 'normally' (i.e. with a functioning machine) happens if one removes the internal fuse - as things are, I don't know whether it is correct or incorrect that removing that fuse causes the error to appear when no L lead is plugged in. Were it not for the fact that one has to totally disassemble the machine to get at the fuse, I'l probably ask you to find out for me

Kind Regards, John

 

[stillp]

See ebay item 172747982576

 

[EFLImpudence]

Ha ha. That presumably is supposed to signify it works.

 

[JohnW2]

See ebay item 172747982576

Thanks. That's one of several on eBay that I'm currently 'watching'. That one's still got 6 days to go, and, if it follows the usual pattern, it will eventually get up to £180-£200 or thereabouts. Two have sold in the last 12 hours for about that price.

Kind Regards, John