Who uses Pagers these days anyway?

[Mrs Ten Names]

Yes, but that wasn’t the question

It wasn't an answer.

Because it’s a wealthy country and beneficial as an ally, secondly it’s powerful enough to be a controlling influence in the Middle East and thirdly geo politics: Israel is effectively on the side of the West and against Iran, Russia and Arab nations / factions which dislike the West.

You said Israel was beneficial to the West as an ally, except that it's interests are demonstrably not the same as the West's.
Israel will pursue its own interests despite, and in denial of, the very vocal requests of the West.
Israel has become so unruly that the UN and some western powers are making very strong arguments for Israel to abandon its war because of its criminal pursuit of that war.

The West is better off without an ally than with an unruly, unreliable ally intent on pursuing its own interests, with the provided arsenal of arms, in spite of the interests of the rest of the world.

 

[Odds]

Of course, but Himmie is being dishonest by not including Hamas, they don’t want a 2 state solution.

The poor people of Palestine are pawns in a war game between Israel and Hamas and its proxies.

Both sides are equally bad

How about a one-state solution where Arab and Jew have equal rights?

No, really, why not?

Oh, alright, have your war. Have another one. Buy one, get one free. But this futile aim of eradicating Hamas won't change the day-to-day lives of ordinary Palestinians in the event of certain military victory for Israel. Another generation raised within the ruin of Gaza will be ready to take up arms against their oppressor soon enough.

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

I never mentioned the UK
I said they were terrorists, which they are.

Israel has been using state sponsored terrorism for decades.

State of Israel has been accused of engaging in state-sponsored terrorism as well as committing acts of state terrorism on a daily basis in the Palestinian territories.
An early example of Israeli state-sponsored was the 1954 Lavon Affair, a botched bomb plot in Egypt that led to the resignation of the Israeli defence minister at the time. In the 1970s and 1980s, Israel was also a major supplier of arms to dictatorial regimes in South America, Sub-Saharan Africa, and Asia. In the 21st-century, it has been accused of sponsoring and supporting several terrorist groups as part of its proxy conflict with Iran.

1950–1951 Baghdad bombings
The theory that "certain Jews" carried out the attacks "in order to focus the attention of the Israel Government on the plight of the Jews" was viewed as "more plausible than most" by the British Foreign Office.

The 'Lavon Affair' was an unsuccessful Israeli covert operation.

Israel and state-sponsored terrorism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And many more.

I find it strange how you are so desperately supportive of anything to do ,with Russia…..you post conspiracy theories and misinformation about the Ukraine war and here you are defending a terrorist group funded by Putin and Iran.
Shane on you

Typical misinformation from Vinty the Putin sympathiser

Vinty supports Putin funded Hezbollah

You are again resorting to juvenile accusations because your ability to discuss and analyse a situation has been exhausted.

Because others want to, and have the ability to, discuss issues in an intelligent and analytical way does not mean that they are supportive "of anything to do with Russia" nor that they are conspiracy theories or misinformation, nor that they support terror.

All you are doing is demonstrating that you have exhausted your ability for reasoned discussion.

 

[Notch7]

You can't point the finger at one side

And what are you doing?

 

[Notch7]

How about a one-state solution where Arab and Jew have equal rights?

No, really, why not?

Oh, alright, have your war. Have another one. Buy one, get one free. But this futile aim of eradicating Hamas won't change the day-to-day lives of ordinary Palestinians in the event of certain military victory for Israel. Another generation raised within the ruin of Gaza will be ready to take up arms against their oppressor soon enough.

You are being dishonest

You know very well Hamas don’t want a solution…..so just admit it.

1988 Hamas charter: “the obliteration or dissolution of Israel”

 

[Notch7]

Israel has been using state sponsored terrorism for decades

Yes that is true

Hamas and Hezbollah have been using terrorism for decades.

When will admit both are true?

 

[Odds]

You are being dishonest

You know very well Hamas don’t want a solution…..so just admit it.

1988 Hamas charter: “the obliteration or dissolution of Israel”

Rescinded, i think, in 2017.
Check it yourself @ MiddleEastEye.com

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

yes they are

No they're not. It's without a shadow of doubt that it is Israel that keeps adding to its "War Goals".
Dated 17 September 2024

Israel sets new war goal of returning residents to the north

Israel sets new war goal of returning residents to the north

It has warned it might use force against Hezbollah, whose attacks have forced mass evacuations.

www.bbc.co.uk

A new War Goal added a few days ago, Yes?

Dated July 8 2024. Jewish News Chronicle

Israel’s red lines for a ceasefire are the ability to resume fighting until all war goals have been met;

https://www.jns.org/netanyahu-sets-red-lines-in-hostage-release-talks-with-hamas/

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

Yes that is true

Hamas and Hezbollah have been using terrorism for decades.

When will admit both are true?

Which came first Israel, Hamas or Hezbollah, and why?
Here's a little hint:

The Hamas movement was founded by Palestinian Islamic scholar Ahmad Yasin in 1987, after the outbreak of the First Intifada against the Israeli occupation.

Hamas - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Hezbollah was established by Lebanese clerics primarily to fight the 1982 Israeli invasion of Lebanon.

Hezbollah - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On May 14, 1948, David Ben-Gurion, the head of the Jewish Agency, proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel

Milestones in the History of U.S. Foreign Relations - Office of the Historian

history.state.gov 3.0 shell

history.state.gov

And within two years of the founding of Israel they were engaged in state sponsored terrorism.

1950–51 Baghdad bombings

Israel and state-sponsored terrorism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

And what are you doing?

I'm using intelligent and analytical reasoning in an attempt to persuade observers that war in the Middle East is not a requirement nor a path to peace. It is quite the opposite.

You cannot impose peace. One party can impose war on the other side, but no party can impose peace on the other side.

Ehud Barak

Even with the creation of buffer zones, etc the UN, in its history, has not achieved an imposed peace on warring parties, merely a ceasefire.

 

[ajohn]

Have a read, it's a decent article.

It reads like the gaza peace deal - ever so close providing all sides get what they want, Including the US. The US view doesn't look to be a true Palestinian state as that word is usually used. Just back to a pre Hamas set up maybe with even tighter controls in some areas. Security being down to Israel again which is part of the reasons for the problems.

Getting the Saudi to sign up some deal with Israel is seen as a feather in the cap of who ever does it. The US feeling is that achieving this would cause the others to fall in line.

The US Israel relationship is hard to get to grips with. I suspect it goes back to this even if no real need now.

Soviet Middle Eastern foreign policy during the Cold War - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I love the given reason for the drift to the west. More likely due to an ailing Russia. The diplomatic ties will still exist to some extent or the other. The attraction to the US - weapons, pure and simple. One state gets all it needs for free.

 

[ajohn]

How about a one-state solution where Arab and Jew have equal rights?

Iran gets to speak at the UN at times for obvious reasons. That is what they see as the only solution - they are very probably correct providing the refugee camps are handled correctly. Those are not fields of tents as these things usually are. They are built up areas.