Putin, arse, elbow
- Thread starter JohnD
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The Russian flagship in fact. They are saying munitions went up and it is quite seriously damaged.
Satellite pics will confirm if it was self inflicted or Ukrainian missiles.
The Russians are stating they are evacuating the full ships company and is being towed to port.
This is a big 40 year old ship with a crew of 500 so the damage must be significant.
Their declaration that their main armament is not affected is implausible as it has lost all propulsion and is on fire.
During the 90's our Royal Navy was on good terms with the Russian Navy due to the historical links including our Arctic convoys in WW2.
I spent a day on one of their 'relatively' modern destroyers and was rather shocked at what I saw.
Their NCOs and Officers were all clued up, but the crew also consisted of hundreds of conscripts who were dressed like street urchins and treated terribly by the NCOs
The ship's damage control / firefighting capability was shambolic as their strategy at the time was to go in, fire their missiles and get out. No strategy to stay afloat and fight.
So I am not surprised if a self inflicted fire got out of hand.
If it was x2 missiles, was the ship at suitable defence/action stations to counter a possible threat?
The feedback from the land war so far is that the ground troops went in rather arrogantly and was not prepared for a effective and bloody Ukrainian defence.
Maybe their Navy has the same attitude.
Champagne all round for the Ukrainians to take out the Russian Black Sea Fleet flagship (if they did
)
The Russians are stating they are evacuating the full ships company and is being towed to port.
This is a big 40 year old ship with a crew of 500 so the damage must be significant.
Their declaration that their main armament is not affected is implausible as it has lost all propulsion and is on fire.
During the 90's our Royal Navy was on good terms with the Russian Navy due to the historical links including our Arctic convoys in WW2.
I spent a day on one of their 'relatively' modern destroyers and was rather shocked at what I saw.
Their NCOs and Officers were all clued up, but the crew also consisted of hundreds of conscripts who were dressed like street urchins and treated terribly by the NCOs
The ship's damage control / firefighting capability was shambolic as their strategy at the time was to go in, fire their missiles and get out. No strategy to stay afloat and fight.
So I am not surprised if a self inflicted fire got out of hand.
If it was x2 missiles, was the ship at suitable defence/action stations to counter a possible threat?
The feedback from the land war so far is that the ground troops went in rather arrogantly and was not prepared for a effective and bloody Ukrainian defence.
Maybe their Navy has the same attitude.
Champagne all round for the Ukrainians to take out the Russian Black Sea Fleet flagship (if they did
)
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I feel sorry for the Russians, it not the Russians war, it is Putin's war. He should be on the front line, leading the charge.
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It will be interesting to see how Putin explains this one away. A big ship being towed into port can not be hidden from the world's media. I would not be surprised if it is conveniently sunk due to an 'onboard accident'.
He controls the media, only the locals in the port it is towed into, will be aware of it.
Reports if to be believed state many ordinary Russians support the 'friendly intervention' into Ukraine. How much of this is down to state media, how much down to love for the motherland no matter what, I can't comment on.
Leaders leading the charge, are you having a laugh? The double standards of such leaders beggars belief. Happy for citizens to be mown down, even their own, whilst their immediate family are holed up somewhere ... usually in the lap of luxury due to ill-gotten gains.
It's back to the swamp thing.
Odd that the missiles turned up a few day after Boris said we would be sending them anti ship missiles
Originally built in Ukraine in the Soviet-era, the vessel entered service in the early 1980s according to Russian media.
The missile cruiser was previously deployed by Moscow in the Syria conflict where it supplied Russian forces in the country with naval protection.
It carries over a dozen Vulkan anti-ship missiles and an array of anti-submarine and mine-torpedo weapons, the reports said.
The missile is an improved soviet design - extended range. Land launch.
When deployed, a Neptune coastal defence system comprises a USPU-360 truck-based mobile launcher, four missiles, a TZM-360 transport/reload vehicle, a RCP-360 command and control vehicle, and a special cargo vehicle. The system is designed to operate up to 25 kilometres (16 mi) inland of the coastline.[3]
A Neptune missile including rocket motor is 5.05 metres (199 in) in length, with a cross-shaped hard wing. Neptune missiles are designed to be housed in transport and launch containers (TLC) with dimensions 5.30 by 0.60 by 0.60 metres (209 in × 24 in × 24 in). The system has a maximum range of about 300 kilometres (190 mi).[16][17] A single missile weighs 870 kilograms (1,920 lb), of which 150 kilograms (330 lb) is the warhead.
How much of a loss - depends. Some of the cruise missiles have been ship launched and range wise some of their cruise missile could hit the UK. Which ships - pass. ICBM's well anywhere.
Seems the do have one independent polling setup. R4 report, Putin 80% poplar.
Originally built in Ukraine in the Soviet-era, the vessel entered service in the early 1980s according to Russian media.
The missile cruiser was previously deployed by Moscow in the Syria conflict where it supplied Russian forces in the country with naval protection.
It carries over a dozen Vulkan anti-ship missiles and an array of anti-submarine and mine-torpedo weapons, the reports said.
The missile is an improved soviet design - extended range. Land launch.
When deployed, a Neptune coastal defence system comprises a USPU-360 truck-based mobile launcher, four missiles, a TZM-360 transport/reload vehicle, a RCP-360 command and control vehicle, and a special cargo vehicle. The system is designed to operate up to 25 kilometres (16 mi) inland of the coastline.[3]
A Neptune missile including rocket motor is 5.05 metres (199 in) in length, with a cross-shaped hard wing. Neptune missiles are designed to be housed in transport and launch containers (TLC) with dimensions 5.30 by 0.60 by 0.60 metres (209 in × 24 in × 24 in). The system has a maximum range of about 300 kilometres (190 mi).[16][17] A single missile weighs 870 kilograms (1,920 lb), of which 150 kilograms (330 lb) is the warhead.
How much of a loss - depends. Some of the cruise missiles have been ship launched and range wise some of their cruise missile could hit the UK. Which ships - pass. ICBM's
well anywhere.Seems the do have one independent polling setup. R4 report, Putin 80% poplar.
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Still waiting fo evidence of missiles. I followeed links to a purported video on soc med. It was completely black apart from a few white spots!
I don't see how they can get truck-mounted missiles across the country. Russia has check points everywhere, srveillance...
I don't see how they can get truck-mounted missiles across the country. Russia has check points everywhere, srveillance...
It's a Ukrainian developed missile, similar to a Cruise, designed for anti-shipping. I would assume it (like Cruise) had to be directed against a point on the earth, using enhanced GPS rather than at an object - which means they were either lucky to hit it, or the ship was stationary.
1980s Puma helicopters were equipped with a pre gps nav system called TANS. As well as setting a point on the earth and steering to it, you could enter the course and speed of a moving target from a start point* and steer to that too. I'm sure it's not been a huge leap in tech so that cruise missiles can do the same...
*Mmm, now how would they get the start point...?
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