TV in bathroom - regs and safety

[ban-all-sheds]

Iggifer - it is not worth trying to reason with someone who does not possess any.

You'd be better off using that time to complain to the site about Winston's bonkers obsessions, and ask that they just stop him posting his destructive nonsense in the first place.

 

[winston1]

What if the item you want to supply has a wall wart power supply? Not all, but some boosters do.

Would you then make up a flying lead with a BS546 plug on one end and a BS1363 trailing socket on the other?

Would you then make up a flying lead with a BS546 plug on one end and a BS1363 trailing socket on the other?

Don't be so stupid.

I don't think Simon said anything about supplying something with a wall wart. The answer obviously is to make sure the power supply is not that type. Wire ended ones are available.

Boosters are usually phantom powered up the coax from a power supply behind the TV.

Going back to this "inaccessible" power circuit. This seems to imply that there are no sockets upstairs, otherwise why is it necessary to lift flooring?
Any socket on a wall upstairs can be extended to the loft with a channel upwards. No need to lift the floor, or go through joists or noggins. Of course the ideal would have been, with a new build, to request power in the loft at the outset.

 

[Iggifer]

Don't be so stupid.

I don't think Simon said anything about supplying something with a wall wart. The answer obviously is to make sure the power supply is not that type. Wire ended ones are available.

Boosters are usually phantom powered up the coax from a power supply behind the TV.

Going back to this "inaccessible" power circuit. This seems to imply that there are no sockets upstairs, otherwise why is it necessary to lift flooring?
Any socket on a wall upstairs can be extended to the loft with a channel upwards. No need to lift the floor, or go through joists or noggins. Of course the ideal would have been, with a new build, to request power in the loft at the outset.

 

[JohnW2]

Don't be so stupid. .... I don't think Simon said anything about supplying something with a wall wart.

What planet are you on? Don't you understand that by far the most common reason for people wanting to install BS1363 socket, from a lighting circuit, in a loft is that they need to plug a wall wart into something?

The answer obviously is to make sure the power supply is not that type. Wire ended ones are available.

We've been through this before. Purchased small items of equipment usually come with their own power supply, which will often be a wall wart. Even if people wanted to spend more money for a different PSU that didn't need a BS1363 socket, many would have difficulties in selecting a suitable one, and that's before one starts thinking about the warranty (with good reason in this case).

Kind Regards, John

 

[winston1]

Iggifer - it is not worth trying to reason with someone who does not possess any.

True, but that does not apply to me.

You'd be better off using that time to complain to the site about Winston's bonkers obsessions, and ask that they just stop him posting his destructive nonsense in the first place.

You have a difference of opinion, simple as that.

Neither you or he is a moderator. Backstreet moderation is not welcome.

 

[winston1]

What planet are you on? Don't you understand that by far the most common reason for people wanting to install BS1363 socket, from a lighting circuit, in a loft is that they need to plug a wall wart into something?


Kind Regards, John

There are lots of things people want to plug in in lofts. A vacuum cleaner for example to clean the place up.

We've been through this before. Purchased small items of equipment usually come with their own power supply, which will often be a wall wart. Even if people wanted to spend more money for a different PSU that didn't need a BS1363 socket, many would have difficulties in selecting a suitable one, and that's before one starts thinking about the warranty (with good reason in this case).

Kind Regards, John

I don't think it is a warranty problem. As I said earlier putting a socket in the loft is easy. Just channel down an upstairs wall to an existing socket. No floorboards to lift at all.

 

[JohnW2]

There are lots of things people want to plug in in lofts. A vacuum cleaner for example to clean the place up.

As I've said before, if one labels the socket appropriately and makes it impossible to remove the ('intended') plug without the use of 'a tool', anyone who manages to plug in their vacuum cleaner deserves the darkness into which they get plunged.

I don't think it is a warranty problem.

I think the manufacturer might disagree with you if a user had tried to run their product from a power supply (that was not suitable for it) other than the one provided with the product.

As I said earlier putting a socket in the loft is easy. Just channel down an upstairs wall to an existing socket. No floorboards to lift at all.

"Just" channel down an upstairs wall?

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

A vacuum cleaner for example to clean the place up.

... to clean up the place - or better still
... to clean the place.

although you would be welcome at the BBC - particularly the traffic reports department.

 

[SimonH2]

Don't be so stupid.

I don't think Simon said anything about supplying something with a wall wart. The answer obviously is to make sure the power supply is not that type. Wire ended ones are available.

Equipment comes with what it comes with.
In this case, no, it wasn't a booster powered up the cable (no idea why, the aerial installer was a bit of a cowboy IMO), the unit he fitted was mains powered, needing a "13A" socket, and providing power to the additional amplifier on the pole (yes, two amplifiers, part of why I think he was a cowboy). Not down to me, mum hadn't bought the house yet, otherwise I;d have told him to sling his hook (and for good measure, how to you propose to "cut back on" the spare length on those cables you vandalised ?)

Going back to this "inaccessible" power circuit. This seems to imply that there are no sockets upstairs, otherwise why is it necessary to lift flooring?

To get at the power cables. "Loft" is part of the top floor, which has sockets. But the flooring is large sheets, all T&G, glued together and glued down - layour is such that to get to a power cable you'd have to make swiss cheese of the floor.

Any socket on a wall upstairs can be extended to the loft with a channel upwards.

So ripping up the newly plastered walls then.
As I already said, not wanting to rip up the new plaster IS a reason. You can argue if it's a good one, but it is a reason, and in a newbuild where the plaster is all new (and very nice and smooth) I'd argue that not ripping it up is a good reason.

 

[bernardgreen]

Winston. There is no regulation which bans the use of a 13 amp type socket on a lighting supply circuit. You may not like that but that is fact.

Changing a plug in power supply for a wired in supply will create problems other than warranty. Would you allow it to be wired via a switched ( double pole ) fused outlet ? If that is not acceptable to you then consider what would happen when the power unit failed and tripped the lighting circuit. Darkness would ensue until an electrician ( with torch ) arrived to disconnect the faulty power unit from the lighting circuit and thus allow the lighting circuit to operate again

 

[DaveHerns]

Have you got an airing cupboard? Why not take a supply from the immersion heater etc ? You won't be in darkness if it fuses and no real need to channel the wiring into the plaster.

 

[winston1]

Winston. There is no regulation which bans the use of a 13 amp type socket on a lighting supply circuit.

I know, but that does not alter the fact it is bad practice.

Changing a plug in power supply for a wired in supply will create problems other than warranty. Would you allow it to be wired via a switched ( double pole ) fused outlet ? If that is not acceptable to you then consider what would happen when the power unit failed and tripped the lighting circuit. Darkness would ensue until an electrician ( with torch ) arrived to disconnect the faulty power unit from the lighting circuit and thus allow the lighting circuit to operate again

FCU's are not required on lighting circuits which are adequately fused already.The presence of a FCU would not stop the lighting circuit tripping as a 3 amp cartridge fuse has no discrimination with a 6 amp MCB.

 

[winston1]

and makes it impossible to remove the ('intended') plug without the use of 'a tool',

How do you do that?

 

[bernardgreen]

The Switched FCU would provide easy isolation of a defective wired in device.

The presence of a FCU would not stop the lighting circuit tripping as a 3 amp cartridge fuse has no discrimination with a 6 amp MCB.

A standard 1 amp cartridge fuse would blow rapidly on a 5 amp fault current while the 6 amp MCB would not trip on 5 amps.

OH DEAR I may have triggered Winston into stating the case ( his case ) against the use of 1 amp fuses.

 

[winston1]

In this case, no, it wasn't a booster powered up the cable (no idea why, the aerial installer was a bit of a cowboy IMO), the unit he fitted was mains powered, needing a "13A" socket, and providing power to the additional amplifier on the pole (yes, two amplifiers, part of why I think he was a cowboy). Not down to me, mum hadn't bought the house yet, otherwise I;d have told him to sling his hook

A cowboy is a man who rounds up cattle on horseback.

But that aside you are implying that you know all about aerial installations. Wrong.

With a weak signal a masthead amplifier would be used. A second additional amplifier would then be used to distribute the now stronger signal to multiple TVs.

Seeing as the house was not bought yet why did you not ask the developer to provide power in the loft?

How did you get the feeds from the amplifier to the TVs? Did you channel down the walls or surface mount it?