EV are they worth it?

[flameport]

Isn't it the case that the more 'gizmos' you have, the quicker your battery will deplete?

No.

The alternator in a car powers the items in the car and charges the 12V battery. Cars with more electrical gubbins in them have more powerful alternators.
The 12V battery is only used when the car is started, or when it's sitting there with the engine off and someone has left various items on. That's why there is a red battery warning light which illuminates when the car is switched on but the engine is not running.

The only ways to deplete the 12V battery are to leave items in the car switched on when the engine is off, or multiple cycles of starting, driving for a couple of minutes, stop.

It's the same for ICE, hybrids and full electric - the only difference with electric vehicles is that the 12V battery is charged from the traction battery when the car is switched on because they don't have an alternator or an engine to drive an alternator.

To recap, he had three consecutive Picassos from new and never once had a flat battery,

Quite. There was something wrong with the Prius or the 12V battery in it.

 

[Brigadier]

Therefore, is there a general consensus here that EVs are not necessarily suitable for occasional drivers?

Your granddad's Prius was not an EV, so his travails were of no relevance to your point.

 

[Hysteresis]

This EV problem may have been aired already but with 141 pages to wade through I thought I would mention the issue any way.
A colleague of mine has a top of the range BMW EV. Absolutely superb car and performance BUT BUT BUT and another BUT.
He had to attend a Meeting which required a 250 mile trip and a overnight stay in an Hotel so could recharge overnight, So apparently no problem, the hotel had Slow charging facilities.
He arrived at his destination no problem at all as planned. The recharge would take around 12 hours again no problem. He then got a telephone call from his wife detailing a health emergency and for him to return home ASAP. He couldn't as his car was out of charge and was not capable of doing the 250 mile return journey and needed a full charge to do it, so he was stranded. Unable to attend to the medical emergency.
SImilar situation could arise to anyone, so beware of the EV's considerable issues.

 

[flameport]

He couldn't as his car was out of charge and was not capable of doing the 250 mile return journey and needed a full charge to do it, so he was stranded. Unable to attend to the medical emergency.
SImilar situation could arise to anyone, so beware of the EV's considerable issues.

Unrelated to it being an EV.

That EV could have rapid charged at a nearby facility which would have taken 30 minutes or possibly less depending on the exact model of car.
If it was a petrol car, it would still have had to be refuelled somewhere, which would take a minimum of 5 minutes.
25 minutes saved perhaps. In reality could be less.

However that return journey of 250 miles would have taken at least 5 hours even assuming it was mostly motorways and there was no other traffic, roadworks or any of the other usual delays.
An extra 20-25 minutes on that journey is irrelevant.

 

[IT Minion]

Yeah, either there is a lot of very important detail that's been missed out or the owner is an idiot who shouldn't be trusted with any vehicle at all.

Every service station has fast chargers. These days they aren't left broken for days or weeks at a time. If he was unwise enough to run the battery down to the point that he couldn't make his way to a fast charger then he would need to slow charge until he had the range to get to a fast charger.

So it might have added an hour to the 4/5 hour drive back. Not great, but let's not overstate it.

 

[Ollyfp]

No.

The alternator in a car powers the items in the car and charges the 12V battery. Cars with more electrical gubbins in them have more powerful alternators.
The 12V battery is only used when the car is started, or when it's sitting there with the engine off and someone has left various items on. That's why there is a red battery warning light which illuminates when the car is switched on but the engine is not running.

The only ways to deplete the 12V battery are to leave items in the car switched on when the engine is off, or multiple cycles of starting, driving for a couple of minutes, stop.

It's the same for ICE, hybrids and full electric - the only difference with electric vehicles is that the 12V battery is charged from the traction battery when the car is switched on because they don't have an alternator or an engine to drive an alternator.


Quite. There was something wrong with the Prius or the 12V battery in it.

Possibly an issue, but if there was, the main dealer never acknowledged it.

 

[Hysteresis]

Unrelated to it being an EV.

That EV could have rapid charged at a nearby facility which would have taken 30 minutes or possibly less depending on the exact model of car.
If it was a petrol car, it would still have had to be refuelled somewhere, which would take a minimum of 5 minutes.
25 minutes saved perhaps. In reality could be less.

However that return journey of 250 miles would have taken at least 5 hours even assuming it was mostly motorways and there was no other traffic, roadworks or any of the other usual delays.
An extra 20-25 minutes on that journey is irrelevant.

There were NO rapid Charge facility anywhere near the hotel. The car was low on charge as you would expect, the point of the problem was that the journey was well planned and charge was to be undertaken over night which was the plan. Many journeys have unexpected consequences, but running out of fuel is not one of them unless of course you haven to have an EV. Time lost as you describe is not an issue, the rechargeability is.
Your silly comment of it not being an EV issue is completely missing the point, the fact that is was an EV caused the problem.

 

[Ollyfp]

Your granddad's Prius was not an EV, so his travails were of no relevance to your point.

It's relevant because we were discussing the rapid evolution of the EV. Early hybrids were part of that, of course. I struggle to keep up with the conversation too. This forum is quite unique in that the contributors all have useful knowledge to share. It's more of a think tank in that respect. I like it.

 

[Hysteresis]

Yeah, either there is a lot of very important detail that's been missed out or the owner is an idiot who shouldn't be trusted with any vehicle at all.

Every service station has fast chargers. These days they aren't left broken for days or weeks at a time. If he was unwise enough to run the battery down to the point that he couldn't make his way to a fast charger then he would need to slow charge until he had the range to get to a fast charger.

So it might have added an hour to the 4/5 hour drive back. Not great, but let's not overstate it.

The person involved is No Idiot, he is a highly educated, professional person who planned his journey meticulously, but a medical emergency is totally unexpected which cannot be planned by its very nature. You are certainly mis-informed regarding EVERY service station having fast chargers. Many service station dont have any and many more have chargers which are in use or are unavailable.
I am a fan of EV's but they have their limitations and long journeys is one of them.

 

[Ollyfp]

This EV problem may have been aired already but with 141 pages to wade through I thought I would mention the issue any way.
A colleague of mine has a top of the range BMW EV. Absolutely superb car and performance BUT BUT BUT and another BUT.
He had to attend a Meeting which required a 250 mile trip and a overnight stay in an Hotel so could recharge overnight, So apparently no problem, the hotel had Slow charging facilities.
He arrived at his destination no problem at all as planned. The recharge would take around 12 hours again no problem. He then got a telephone call from his wife detailing a health emergency and for him to return home ASAP. He couldn't as his car was out of charge and was not capable of doing the 250 mile return journey and needed a full charge to do it, so he was stranded. Unable to attend to the medical emergency.
SImilar situation could arise to anyone, so beware of the EV's considerable issues.

Yes, we do have to be honest about the limitations of EVs. As I mentioned earlier, my neighbour was caught short following a power cut. He left his Jaguar EV at home and used his wife's Scirocco.

 

[Ollyfp]

Every service station has fast chargers.

'Tha's not the case in North Norfolk boy! (sound of carrot being crunched)' lol

 

[flameport]

There were NO rapid Charge facility anywhere near the hotel.

predictable

 

[Ollyfp]

My wife is currently looking to change her car. She's going to be driving 100 miles every day through winter and beyond. The tractors, trucks, flash-floods, mud and hills up our way make driving her little Ford Fiesta quite a frightening experience, so we're currently looking at a 2015 diesel Nissan Qashqai. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!

 

[IT Minion]

The person involved is No Idiot, he is a highly educated, professional person who planned his journey meticulously, but a medical emergency is totally unexpected which cannot be planned by its very nature. You are certainly mis-informed regarding EVERY service station having fast chargers. Many service station dont have any and many more have chargers which are in use or are unavailable.
I am a fan of EV's but they have their limitations and long journeys is one of them.

Which don't?

 

[IT Minion]

My wife is currently looking to change her car. She's going to be driving 100 miles every day through winter and beyond. The tractors, trucks, flash-floods, mud and hills up our way make driving her little Ford Fiesta quite a frightening experience, so we're currently looking at a 2015 diesel Nissan Qashqai. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!

100 miles a day, assuming it's for work is 22,000 miles a year.

That's around £3-4k of diesel. You'd cut that by half with an EV. Lower if you get a specific EV charging tariff.

That age Quashqai is 6-8k? Bump it up to a 62kWh 2020 leaf (ral world range 200 miles or more) for £11-12k and you'll break even after 3 years and not be driving a bloody Quashqai.