There is no such thing as "two tier policing"

[JonathanM]

But why was the law not so determined after the Leeds riots ?

I caught the Sky papers review in the early hours for the first time in many months. Henry Hill, the deputy editor of Conservative Home, was comparing the response to the riots. He said that he is a strong supporter of law and order, but that the response to the Harehills (Leeds) riot was standard police practice i.e. they try to let them subside naturally before going in mob handed. So, he saw nothing wrong with the response to the Harehills riot. I thought that was interesting coming from a strong conservative. I've noticed, previously, in his Telegraph articles that he is a pretty principled guy and not somebody who will twist the facts to suit a narrative.

Since the Harehills riot there have been twenty seven arrests with more expected. Four charged immediately and others bailed pending enquiries. Again this is standard practice. The right wing demos are obviously different because of the scale and spread. The police and government are following the (very successful) 2011 playbook.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Code name Snake at work

He just can't stop himself can he.

Very very dangerous person. Too many people are easily led

 

[Munroast]

I caught the Sky papers review in the early hours for the first time in many months. Henry Hill, the deputy editor of Conservative Home, was comparing the response to the riots. He said that he is a strong supporter of law and order, but that the response to the Harehills (Leeds) riot was standard police practice i.e. they try to let them subside naturally before going in mob handed. So, he saw nothing wrong with the response to the Harehills riot. I thought that was interesting coming from a strong conservative. I've noticed, previously, in his Telegraph articles that he is a pretty principled guy and not somebody who will twist the facts to suit a narrative.

Since the Harehills riot there have been twenty seven arrests with more expected. Four charged immediately and others bailed pending enquiries. Again this is standard practice. The right wing demos are obviously different because of the scale and spread. The police and government are following the (very successful) 2011 playbook.

to make any sort of comparison we need to look at police, court and government attitudes in the week after the leeds riot, and compare that to the attitudes after the the RW idiots after the southport trajedy. Within a week we are already jailing them, and quite rightly so.

I am in no doubt that those involved in Leeds will face much tougher justice now as the police and courts demonstrate there is no disparity - but just consider that week or so after the harehills and compare that.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

to make any sort of comparison we need to look at police, court and government attitudes in the week after the leeds riot, and compare that to the attitudes after the the RW idiots after the southport trajedy. Within a week we are already jailing them, and quite rightly so.

I am in no doubt that those involved in Leeds will face much tougher justice now as the police and courts demonstrate there is no disparity - but just consider that week or so after the harehills and compare that.

Different scale though.

Compare like with like. Were they quickly organised all over the country ?

Have arrests been made after harehills?

 

[ajohn]

The police were the targets of the riots so they backed off. Locals as it turned out help quieten it. The police then went in and made the arrests. The police were called in to help remove the children as the people who held them refused. Some judge later had them moved to another arm of the family.

 

[blup]

Grooming gangs in Rochdale etc has been a monumental failure, but it’s not evidence of 2 tier policing in regards to protests.

Policing of far right gangs and their establishment mates would be in the lower of the two tiers if indeed they existed.

The met were deemed institutionally racist.

Thirty years ago, but still understaffed for the challenges they face.

Ethnic minorities are more likely to face stop and search

Its an easy option, eventually, the logic goes, they will get lucky

Ethnic minorities are more likely to face injury or death from police interactions

Often mental heqlth episodes which the police are woefully inexperienced to deal with

This 2 tier policing is just another right wing crock of sh1t
It’s the same bull used to claim BBC are left wing biased.

Two tier policing is a variation of the argument that if the police were less woke, things would get back to normal. Both are false political arguments used to distract from chronic under funding and poor recruitment.

 

[blup]

The greatest injustice was the ignoring of the abuse endemic within Catholic and Christian organisations, not only in UK, but endemic in other countries also.

Not true, the catholic church was deemed responsible for the acts of its staff, so faced more legal claims than the non denominational and non christian churches who were more adept at keeping stuff quiet, and defending legal claims because they were set up as local charities separate from each other, and not worth suing. The bause within religious organisations is probably fairly evenly spread out.

But the typical focus by those who want to use it as an excuse to criticise foreigners is always to drag the attention back to the cases of Rotherham and Rochdale.

Yes, it has been abused in the way you describe, but there was a societal cover up to avoid offending community sensitivities. My point is that all of society was in denial at that time.

The inquiry has been completed on those cases, the blame has been apportioned. It has taken decades to highlight the abuse committed in religious institutions, and it has only scratched the surface.

I cant think of one inquiry that has changed things for the better, which couldn't have been achieved by the application of common sense and human decency in the first place. The horizon scandal shows that absolutely zero has been learned about the culture of cover up and (often financial) reputational protection

The continual attention on Rochdale and Rotherham, by the select few, is typical and illustrates how the concern is not really about sexual and physical abuse, it's far more about grabbing a stick to beat their particular drum.

I think the southport tragedy illustrates this, even though the attacker was shown not to be the person the fake news said he was.

Hence my repetitive mantra of bigoted people exploiting any hook on which to hang their prejudice.

It's been noted.

 

[Mottie]

The police make operational decisions based on risk not race.

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

Grooming gangs in Rochdale etc has been a monumental failure, but it’s not evidence of 2 tier policing in regards to protests.

Policing of far right gangs and their establishment mates would be in the lower of the two tiers if indeed they existed.

You're talking of two different aspects.
The prioritising and assigning of resources to ongoing issues is totally different to the concept of two-tier policing.
But you've also argued that the police ignored the grooming gangs in Rochdale, so there was no assigning of resources to that issue.
So if the Rochdale issues were ignored, by your logic, even fewer resources would be assigned to extreme right wing gangs.
I think you would now appreciate the illogicality of your argument.

The met were deemed institutionally racist.

Thirty years ago, but still understaffed for the challenges they face.

Really? Thirty years ago?

Met police found to be institutionally racist, misogynistic and homophobic
Tue 21 Mar 2023 00.01 GMT

Met police found to be institutionally racist, misogynistic and homophobic

Author of landmark report says Met can ‘no longer presume that it has the permission of the people of London to police them’

www.theguardian.com

Is there any room for me in that time warp of yours?

Ethnic minorities are more likely to face stop and search

Its an easy option, eventually, the logic goes, they will get lucky

It's a foolish and misguided policy. The repercussions are obvious.
And it's an example of two-tier policing, but one where the victims are those with non-white skin.
It invariable produces mistrust in the first instance, and eventually a mismatch in those arrested, charged and imprisoned. That then becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Ethnic minorities are more likely to face injury or death from police interactions

Often mental heqlth episodes which the police are woefully inexperienced to deal with

Another self-fulfilling prophecy. If the ethnic minorities are more likely to be stopped, searched, arrested, charged and imprisoned a whole section of society will suffer and feel discriminated against. They will also be wary of being stopped by the police, and will resist any order they think is unwarranted.

This 2 tier policing is just another right wing crock of sh1t
It’s the same bull used to claim BBC are left wing biased.

Two tier policing is a variation of the argument that if the police were less woke, things would get back to normal. Both are false political arguments used to distract from chronic under funding and poor recruitment.

The process of dealing with institutional racism is to introduce workshop, lectures, policies, etc that deal with the racism.
If these equality processes are dismissed, labelled and resisted as woke, they will fail. The two-tier policy discriminating against ethnic minorities will be replicated and sustained ad infinitum.

 

[Ihavenojob]

What when the police back off when the demonstration is full of non whites, come on its totally two tier policing, like not tackling the grooming gangs up north.

Saw a video of a mini "riot" in Croydinistan, plod did **** all.

 

[Notch7]

to make any sort of comparison we need to look at police, court and government attitudes in the week after the leeds riot, and compare that to the attitudes after the the RW idiots after the southport trajedy. Within a week we are already jailing them, and quite rightly so.

I am in no doubt that those involved in Leeds will face much tougher justice now as the police and courts demonstrate there is no disparity - but just consider that week or so after the harehills and compare that.

You are desperately trying to claim there is some equivalence

So come on, let’s see you list that scope of the damage to property and the aggression to the police of Harwhill compared to the Farage riots like Southport and Rotherham.

 

[Notch7]

What when the police back off when the demonstration is full of non whites

You’ve answered your own point ya muppet

The police back off of its a peaceful demonstration (your word)

Gosh Algas do you think the police would back off if yobs were thriwning bricks and lumps of fence at them….and setting light to hotels.

 

[Notch7]

I caught the Sky papers review in the early hours for the first time in many months. Henry Hill, the deputy editor of Conservative Home, was comparing the response to the riots. He said that he is a strong supporter of law and order, but that the response to the Harehills (Leeds) riot was standard police practice i.e. they try to let them subside naturally before going in mob handed. So, he saw nothing wrong with the response to the Harehills riot. I thought that was interesting coming from a strong conservative. I've noticed, previously, in his Telegraph articles that he is a pretty principled guy and not somebody who will twist the facts to suit a narrative.

Since the Harehills riot there have been twenty seven arrests with more expected. Four charged immediately and others bailed pending enquiries. Again this is standard practice. The right wing demos are obviously different because of the scale and spread. The police and government are following the (very successful) 2011 playbook.

Yeah Henry Hill is ok, I agree with a lot of what he says

 

[Mrs Ten Names]

The greatest injustice was the ignoring of the abuse endemic within Catholic and Christian organisations, not only in UK, but endemic in other countries also.

Not true, the catholic church was deemed responsible for the acts of its staff, so faced more legal claims than the non denominational and non christian churches who were more adept at keeping stuff quiet, and defending legal claims because they were set up as local charities separate from each other, and not worth suing. The bause within religious organisations is probably fairly evenly spread out.

Your response does nothing to address the centuries long endemic abuse within the religious institutions, nor the inaction of society to address those issues.

But the typical focus by those who want to use it as an excuse to criticise foreigners is always to drag the attention back to the cases of Rotherham and Rochdale.

Yes, it has been abused in the way you describe, but there was a societal cover up to avoid offending community sensitivities. My point is that all of society was in denial at that time.

In exactly the same way that the abuse in religious institutions was ignored and/or covered up. So the Rotherham and Rochdale were in no way unusual nor out of the ordinary.
Yet the focus is often drawn to those case as though they were extra-ordinary. They were not. The focus is merely a useful hook for certain people on which to hang their prejudices.

The inquiry has been completed on those cases, the blame has been apportioned. It has taken decades to highlight the abuse committed in religious institutions, and it has only scratched the surface.

I cant think of one inquiry that has changed things for the better, which couldn't have been achieved by the application of common sense and human decency in the first place. The horizon scandal shows that absolutely zero has been learned about the culture of cover up and (often financial) reputational protection

Absolutely. The application of common sense and human decency could have prevented most inequality in society.

The continual attention on Rochdale and Rotherham, by the select few, is typical and illustrates how the concern is not really about sexual and physical abuse, it's far more about grabbing a stick to beat their particular drum.

I think the southport tragedy illustrates this, even though the attacker was shown not to be the person the fake news said he was.

I agree, but the blaring difference is that the Southport illustration of racial bigotry was based on fake news.
The racial bigotry shown by certain sections of society demonstrated by the persistent focus on the Rotherham and Rochdale issues is and was based on real events.
Rotherham and Rochdale events were not out of the ordinary, indeed they were minor issues compared to the abuse that has been going on within the religious institutions for centuries, and the ongoing abuse that continues within families by close relatives (usually males).
Neither Rochdale, nor Rotherham, nor the ongoing abuse in Institutions, nor the ongoing abuse within families, should be trivialised. But to persistently prioritise the focus on to one issue, has repercussions. It relieves the focus on the ongoing issues, suggests that abuse has been dealt with, and builds the perception that abuse is contained within factions of society, which in turn foments bigotry.

Hence my repetitive mantra of bigoted people exploiting any hook on which to hang their prejudice.

It's been noted.

 

[Mottie]

Yeah Henry Hill is ok, I agree with a lot of what he says

Henry Hill was a snitch.